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Ignition system overhaul questions

 
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Old 07-11-2012, 05:42 PM
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Ignition system overhaul questions

Right, so here we go people. Coming into my first VTEC engine after driving an '86 FC RX-7 for MANY MOONS! it's come to the point of trying to breathe whatever life i can into an engine that's got over 200k on the clock. I'm curious as to whether an ignition box is worth using on these engines along with a hotter coil and better wires. only hook though, is i'm next to dumb with these, whether resistor or non-resistor type are the way to go? spark plugs are a no brainer as i worked parts for some years and tried to educate people that asian makes use a particular kind of plug for a reason. Im mostly curious as to the proper NON OE plug wires since that would be the only REAL hitch in that equation. no use having all kinds of juice through your ignition if they can't get to your plugs. So anybody who's revamped/upgraded their ignition with aftermarket components please fill me in. Ive stood by MSD products since my first ride, a 1969 El Camino!! I can only imagine you'll net an even bigger benefit on a computer controlled vehicle. not to mention msd would help you get every last bit of power out of the premium fuel these monsters require. times is hard gents, times is hard.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:05 PM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

It's not really worth revamping the ignition, I had basically my whole ignition out and all MSD products in and I wasnt really impressed. I had the coil, wires cap and rotor and a MSD box. it was real easy to wire the whole thing up but I kept on blowing my cap and rotor over and over and it was getting out of hand. I guess it gave a little more performance but I ended up going back to the stock ignition and I'm happy now. I still have my MSD wires on the car, which cost about 100 bux and they are great. That's it tho back to stock coil cap and rotor. if I was you just go with the wires and plugs, don't really go crazy with replacing the coil, the Honda one is fine.
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Old 07-12-2012, 12:59 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

Don't fix what ain't broken. you'll save money and be able to fix bigger stuff that breaks
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Old 07-12-2012, 04:25 PM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

that's a given, my main question was wires and plugs, if you guys have OE part numbers for either NGK or Denso hit this thread back. None of this could've come at a better time as on my drive home CAR RAN LIKE TRAAAASH!?!?! turned into the gutless wonder and sounded like it was into VTEC every time i got into the throttle. Next to no acceleration and i couldn't tell if it was smoking at all since it was nighttime as i was driving. Pulled codes and FOUND FIVE!?!? Every T/S tree i've read through has pointed to EGR/poor fuel/misfire. Which i find funny as i've had zero issues with this ride until my most recent fuel trip. Yes it was premium, and yes i put more than $10 worth in. Had a solid 3/4 of a tank and it ran fine through maybe 1/4 then THIS SCHITT?!? So i'm yankin the EGR valve and gonna hose that thing off, swap plugs after i run some seafoam through it and get out and foot tune the hell out of it. I've just gotta limp it along until sunday since working one job during the week and the second job on saturdays rapes my fckn schedule. If i run this tank through and fuel up again with no issues, gonna be seriously pissed tha hell off. Guess all that money i saved with my kroger plus fuel is goin RIGHT BACK INTO PARTS!!! FML
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:21 PM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

when my egr ports were clogged my car ran like azz, misfiring in 5th gear, ist gear was terrible at times but if u wanna test the egr valve ports just unplug the valve and drive the car, when I did that the car ran perfectly, but threw a code for the egr not working. When the valve opens and the ports are clogged it chokes the engine and it misfires and runs like shyt. I ended up cleaning the valve and I replaced the lower half of the intake manifold and all is well now. I didn't bother cleaning the ports and just bit the bullet and got a new intake manifold.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:52 PM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

I may have to put this info into another or a new thread. but this bastardo died on me, only after slowly but surely running worse and worse, clackin and clickin like crazy then just shut down. wouldn't start back up and eventually got lucky and pushed it into a gas station. cranked it a few times, and wouldn't start, so i sat it out and waited maybe a half hour or so. IT FCKN STARTS BACK UP?!? idled normal, no out of the ordinary noises, so i decide to try and limp it home. well i got home, slowly but surely, it just would NOT accelerate. doing the same thing it was doing before, it would get to maybe 2500rpm then felt like it hit a fuel cut or something, rpms would just drop out and then it caught itself, but still wouldn't run worth crap. All this started yesterday, but only after a decent 45min drive home or so. Started it up this morning and it ran perfect, no hesitation and no power issues. Maybe 5-10 minutes in and it started back to just having NO acceleration. Same issue after work today, good for about 5 mins then the rpms would bump up against maybe 4000 and then drop out. Got home today and yanked the EGR valve, it was as pretty as expected but the plunger moved just fine and didn't hang at all, still cleaned the mother lovin hell out of it since i took the trouble to take the damn thing off. Swapped plugs only to find AUTOLITES in it!?!?!? That aside i put everything back together and started it back up, already idling loads better. Tried to rev it a bit, and once it hit 3000 it was like hitting a wall and just bogged back down to idle. Tried to hold it to 3000 and go higher, no dice. I can almost guarantee that if i get into this thing in the morning and it's running perfect, then 5 mins or so later it's back to the gutless wonder. I'm wagering ignition module or fuel pressure regulator since swapping plugs and cleaning EGR did JACK ****E!! Either of you guys had this issue just point and shoot. I'm still fkcn wigged out on account of i've had this thing a solid 6 months with ZERO issues. This just came out of left field as of this past wednesday afternoon. Only thing significant i've done is change the oil on the 4th. Planning to run the overhead on that thing tomorrow, if nothing else just check to see how bad they might be. Timing belt was changed by NTB at 188k, and it's got 208k on the clock now. Don't know if checking valves is part of a timing belt change, but that's the joys of buying a used ride. It is what it is.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:52 PM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

and sorry about the novel, but information is always helpful. thanks again PZ
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:07 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

I'm guessing the coil or cap and rotor, maybe both.
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:10 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

When it stops at 3k it's limp mode. clear your check engine lights and then try it and it should go past 3k. i had all kinds of problems with limp mode. something is malfuctioning and the car holds itself under 3k so it doesn't damage internals....why 3k you ask? because the ignition timing starts to change at. check for codes then check back with us.
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:11 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

Limp mode could be because a bad cam shaft sensor, or crankshaft sensor. i had this problem for weeks.
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:31 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

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Limp mode could be because a bad cam shaft sensor, or crankshaft sensor. i had this problem for weeks.
yup. what he said. happened to my civic when i first got it. drive fine until it hits a certain temperature then the car cuts into limp mode and wont go above 3k rpm. one thing you could do to confirm that its the same problem i had, when it happens limp it for like 2 minutes. then shut it off and real quick drop down and check if your cat is glowing. it was easy for me to see because my cat is part of the headers so right in front of the engine.
whats happening is the magnetic material in the sensor has degraded so heat de-magnetizes it. yours has just gotten to the point where its not good at all. thats why it happens only 5 minutes after starting.
experience is the best teacher.
if you let it idle when its like that long enough it'll slowly get worse and worse and then it'll just turn off as if you turned of the ignition. i hooked my car up to my teachers computer because he bought a program that could read the sensor pulses. mine i think is supposed to hold at 33 (idk what rate like per second or whatever.) but i watched as it dropped one number at a time until it hit 0 and the car just turned off. was kind of funny actually because it didnt sputter or backfire actually it just went to sleep lol
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:41 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

lookin at the T/S tree i've got it follows to check for a misfire, which is what i HOPE is happening and it's just cutting back the spark timing when it clatters its ass off and dumps the rpm at 3k.
while accelerating T/S In order to check fuel pres/Distributor,wires/ICM
high rpm and under load crank sensor/fuel pres/distributor,wires/ICM/Valve clearance
low rpm EGR/crank sensor/fuel pres

i've just about proven out the EGR isn't the issue since it didn't seem stuck but cleaned the fckn thing anyway. Fuel pressure MAYBE. I am liking the second hand up for sensors, ICM is still scratchin at me since it runs like a top on cold startup, then after some time the stupid juice starts flowin. This last limp home from work the CEL actually flashed a couple times, then stayed on. i've gotta get that thing to trip again and hope it makes it to parts house to check codes. info to come fellas.
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:45 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

@671

dude, come to think of it when it was clackin its ass off and died on me the first time before i pushed it into the gas station, i saw smoke-flipped balls-noticed my temp never got above halfway mark-looked down at exhaust-saw heat eminating from the ENTIRE setup . . . . checking availability first thing tomorrow. luckily NAPA delivers to my job since they're the only widespread parts house that carries parts for class 7 and 8 trucks. Mack and Kenworth, had balls until the EPA stepped in, and now it's a neverending stream of check engine lights. If any of you can find and follow a T/S tree from cummins or Paccar . . . skip it and just beat your head against a brick wall. Mostly the paccar trees . . . go team redundant team go!
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Old 07-13-2012, 01:08 AM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

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@671

dude, come to think of it when it was clackin its ass off and died on me the first time before i pushed it into the gas station, i saw smoke-flipped balls-noticed my temp never got above halfway mark-looked down at exhaust-saw heat eminating from the ENTIRE setup
yeah whats happening there is that the limp mode is screwing with your timing which means its not buring all the fuel the injectors are spraying. hence the smoke, and hence the catalyitic heating up like a bbq grill.
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:02 PM
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Re: Ignition system overhaul questions

my guess is it would be a good idea to change the oil after all this mess eh? since it started and progressively got worse after wednesday, dumpin fuel like crazy only god knows how gnarly that oil really is
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