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cams or tb+intake mani?

 
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Old 07-01-2011, 06:54 PM
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cams or tb+intake mani?

Hey luders I was wondering if I could get some input on what would be more worthwhile for my cash. I have gotten pulled over twice now and threatened to be ticketed for my exhaust if I do not change it to stock, so that is exactly what I am going to do. I already got a hook up for the stock exhaust and am planning to just sell my Greddy Evo2(so if ur interested feel free to hit me up, it will be available some time next week, it has everything except the hi flow cat). So I was curious if I should put the money I receive from the exhaust toward cam shafts (already have the gears) or aftermarket tb and intake manifold. Please include what brand you would suggest with your preference guys, thanks in advance for the help!!!
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Old 07-01-2011, 08:37 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

How much are you asking for the Greddy evo2?
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Old 07-02-2011, 01:05 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
pointless to add aftermarket camshafts to an engine that cant breathe
i thought of that right after i posted this, and i was thinking to go with a vibrant ultra silent resonator on top of the other resonator i already have... problem is i have no idea how much quieter that is going to make it, any idea if it would make a huge difference?
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Old 07-02-2011, 01:07 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 92ProjectSiPrelude4w View Post
How much are you asking for the Greddy evo2?
im going to my mechanic on tuesday to see what we can do, and if i do get a stock setup i will pm u and let u know that the exhaust is available.
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Old 07-02-2011, 04:06 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

If you plan to get more power you have to change EVERYTHING,
you know, the motor is wholeness (right word?) where everything effects on everything.

but since you asked, the oem h22 intake manifold "kills the engine" somewhere after 7000rpm, it cannot give engine enough air, so better intake manifold is upgrade. you dont need new throttle body it can easily make things worse.

and think about this: if you get new cams you might need to upgrade valves, their springs & seats stuff like that also, and that arent cheap

whatever youre planning to do, you cannot win anything with stock exhaust ;) and if you change performance parts you have to tune the engine too so you have to get new ecu

Last edited by TypeT; 07-02-2011 at 04:14 AM.
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Old 07-02-2011, 04:14 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

i wouldnt touch the engine unless i was planning on fully building it for boost or N/A
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Old 07-02-2011, 08:35 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by TypeT View Post
If you plan to get more power you have to change EVERYTHING,
you know, the motor is wholeness (right word?) where everything effects on everything.

but since you asked, the oem h22 intake manifold "kills the engine" somewhere after 7000rpm, it cannot give engine enough air, so better intake manifold is upgrade. you don't need new throttle body it can easily make things worse.

and think about this: if you get new cams you might need to upgrade valves, their springs & seats stuff like that also, and that aren't cheap

whatever you're planning to do, you cannot win anything with stock exhaust ;) and if you change performance parts you have to tune the engine too so you have to get new ecu
The post shown above is full of intelligent win.
A lot of people spend a lot of time worrying about the last 400 revs on the tach ,yet unless your into riding your clutch, a driver spends a small % of his driving time within that range of rpms so in effect is of minor concern except to those who are Dyno enthusiast compared to whats going on in the meat the engines power band in the 4500 to 6500 rpm range.
The truth of the matter is that you can not reconfigure and engine one piece at a time because the characteristics of each part of an engine is a function of the parts that come before and after it.So unless your have some grand plan to re engineer your normally aspirated engine from its input to its output, your efforts are not going to be worth the trouble and your in effect just farking with your finely tuned Honda matched components and are just pissing into the wind. So I suggest that you reinstall you stock exhaust which will make your car less of a target to the cops and focus in on your driving technique which is the single most effective improvement you can make assuming your car is basically in good running order and is equipped with a first rate set of tires if its your desire to keep your challenger experiencing a view as the one shown below.


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Old 07-02-2011, 08:38 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

Do you already have an intake and header? If so, what brands? Gotta tell us what else you have so we know what the best route for you is.

Edit: Omg dont listen to shdriver or typet. You dont have to start upgrading everything all at once. You can easily add on a intake mani and tb without having to add cams, pistons etc etc. Plenty of ppl have done it and plenty of ppl still do it.

Last edited by blackbb6; 07-02-2011 at 08:41 AM.
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Old 07-02-2011, 09:02 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbb6 View Post
Edit: Omg dont listen to shdriver or typet. You dont have to start upgrading everything all at once. You can easily add on a intake mani and tb without having to add cams, pistons etc etc. Plenty of ppl have done it and plenty of ppl still do it.
it just wastes your money (read: its damn expensive) when you have to get it tuned EVERY time you install new part. been there done that.
IF you cant do these things yourself.

and when you add new intake manifold, it gives more air... then you dont get enough fuel - get new injectors and when it gets enough fuel and air your stock exhaust arent enough and so on

Last edited by TypeT; 07-02-2011 at 09:10 AM.
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Old 07-02-2011, 11:26 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

Idk how ur running into issues w/ur exhaust. I'm running full 3" piping w/NO resonator and a vinbrant muffler w/no issues. As for sellin ur exhaust if ur tryin to make power (which u r lol) don't sell. U need to allow the motor to breathe. Just get the vibrant resonator as previously reccomended. That is ur BEST option.
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Old 07-02-2011, 01:47 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by TypeT View Post
it just wastes your money (read: its damn expensive) when you have to get it tuned EVERY time you install new part. been there done that.
IF you cant do these things yourself.

and when you add new intake manifold, it gives more air... then you dont get enough fuel - get new injectors and when it gets enough fuel and air your stock exhaust arent enough and so on
you do realize this isnt a boosted car where you have to tune it even if you put on an intake, right? and he isnt boosting, so bigger injectors for these minor modifications arent necessary. its not like hes going to lean out and melt the engine with just a f*cking intake manifold and exhaust. plus these cars run rich from the factory anyway

to op: vibrant ultra quiets do a good job at quieting things down. i have one with my 3" exhaust and it sounds stock at idle
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Old 07-02-2011, 02:07 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by UPSluder View Post
you do realize this isnt a boosted car where you have to tune it even if you put on an intake, right? and he isnt boosting, so bigger injectors for these minor modifications arent necessary. its not like hes going to lean out and melt the engine with just a f*cking intake manifold and exhaust. plus these cars run rich from the factory anyway
to get full benefits from parts you HAVE to tune.
its useless just bolt on things and expect huge gains without tune them in, to co-operate with other parts.

oem intake manifold doesnt give enough air on top end and oem injectors doesnt give enough fuel there (atleast not with better IM), you have to get it balanced (if you want your car work as it should).
I changed IM & exhaust system (+ head work) whole car went crazy, there was no torque because change of air flows confused motors fuel mixtures to hell -> then stock injectors became too small with normal fuel pressure -> new injectors needed (I decided that injector upgrade is better way than raise fuel pressure).
...now it works great

Last edited by TypeT; 07-02-2011 at 02:21 PM.
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Old 07-02-2011, 02:14 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

dude get the engine to breath and then think about cams and a valve train upgrade(if its a DD and on a budget i would not go above anything stage 1 btw) get your exhaust quiet AND efficent first DON'T get rid of it. its a waste of time and money if you do. do you have a full exaust including a header? if not i would suggest maybe a hytec replica(spelling?) Then get your hands on a good intake and then worry about the manifold and throttle body (may i suggest a euro R manifold). Some people on here talk a good game but in the end i would only listen to blackbb6 upsluder and diamond lude or my self on this. After all no use in modding your car if your going backwards right?
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Old 07-02-2011, 02:23 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

Weird...the Evo2 is street legal.
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Old 07-02-2011, 02:30 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Weird...the Evo2 is street legal.
some cops dont care about little things, some are overzealous?
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Old 07-02-2011, 03:53 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

i get exhaust tickets all day(well when my cars running) i never change my exhaust i just go to court and say i did lol
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Old 07-02-2011, 05:49 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

^just do that


If the cops are messing with you but the exhaust is street legal... Then F the cops!! Do they have a db reader or can they "just tell" it's too loud?

And don't listen to some people on here.. You do not have to tune it everytime you install a new part unless you're boosted or do major work..

You might only see a couple extra hp with a tune so I'd wait until you have more done before worrying about tuning..

And getting it re-tuned is cheap (atleast for me)
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Old 07-03-2011, 04:20 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 00CDMLUDER View Post
And don't listen to some people on here.. You do not have to tune it everytime you install a new part unless you're boosted or do major work..
that separates noobs from pros: pros tune and get it work, noobs just bolt on things and wish the best

whats the point having fancy part which doesnt work properly and get just some gain, not full because youre too lazy to do things correctly, dont really understand that

Last edited by TypeT; 07-03-2011 at 04:30 AM.
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Old 07-03-2011, 04:18 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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that separates noobs from pros: pros tune and get it work, noobs just bolt on things and wish the best

whats the point having fancy part which doesnt work properly and get just some gain, not full because youre too lazy to do things correctly, dont really understand that
You obviously didn't read what I wrote.. Or just didn't comprehend

I'm not saying to not tune it..

If you buy an intake, are you gonna spend another $500 to have it chipped and tuned to see that +1 horse power gain? And then get it tuned when you get a header and again when you change the exhaust.. That's dumb

Or would you rather buy a I/h/e + other mods and then get it tuned once? You will save money and end up with the same hp..

If you are boosted or have a crazy build then tune it right away!

Either way I'm not a newb because my car is tuned
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Old 07-04-2011, 06:15 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 00CDMLUDER View Post
If you buy an intake, are you gonna spend another $500 to have it chipped and tuned to see that +1 horse power gain? And then get it tuned when you get a header and again when you change the exhaust.. That's dumb

Or would you rather buy a I/h/e + other mods and then get it tuned once? You will save money and end up with the same hp..
I havent talked anything about just intake... but intake manifold effects more to air flows, and I think that should be tuned

If intake manifold effects something like +6hp and you only get +3 without tuning its kinda useless buy without configuring your system. It kinda works on half of its potential, right?

And yes, I just did that; "a I/h/e + other mods and then get it tuned once" and I noticed how the whole engine went to hell without tuning thats why Im saying that tuning things is necessary.
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Old 07-04-2011, 12:21 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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I havent talked anything about just intake... but intake manifold effects more to air flows, and I think that should be tuned

If intake manifold effects something like +6hp and you only get +3 without tuning its kinda useless buy without configuring your system. It kinda works on half of its potential, right?

And yes, I just did that; "a I/h/e + other mods and then get it tuned once" and I noticed how the whole engine went to hell without tuning thats why Im saying that tuning things is necessary.
We are pretty much agreeing dude.. I'm not saying to not tune when you install something.. I'm saying buy it all at once or install it all at once to save money..

To really tune it you have to switch over to obd1 if ur obd2.. Ecu($100) (hondata $200-350) (obd2>obd2 harness if ur obd2 $75?) plus the intake manifold $?....... To me all that isn't worth the +3 hp... I would save up and do more at once.. But if you want to tune it everytime you get something or whenever you think a fat chick is gonna ride with you then go ahead. Lol
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Old 07-04-2011, 01:12 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 00CDMLUDER View Post
I'm saying buy it all at once or install it all at once to save money..
heh, I said that at first place
Just saying that you can do things correctly: with tuning you get all the benefit from the parts you have bought. of course its always cheapest not to do anything.. but once you start to do things, you might do them correctly as well

You dont really need buy hondata, if you cannot tune the engine yourself.
I just have Socketed and Chipped P28 ecu + harness - when my car need tuning Ill go to one dyno place to get it done.

And Im sorry, I repeat myself awfully lot

Last edited by TypeT; 07-04-2011 at 01:17 PM.
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Old 07-05-2011, 09:48 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
you have to purchase some kind of engine management, whether it be just a license which the dealer tuner can use (neptune, ectune) or the actual RTP board (neptune, ectune, homodata)
no you dont. your tuner probably have ways to tune your obd1 ecu or
then just download crome or smanager
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Old 07-05-2011, 10:02 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
lmao, how you gonna "tune" smanager without homodata?

crome isnt in my vocabulary.

i AM a tuner. believe me im not just posting **** i saw posted on the internet.
I bought socketed & chipped p28 ecu + harness
then one tuner tuned it with his program (I bet that he used little bit crome or smanager as well at some point) ...I didnt need to spend money to anywhere else
the ecu came with h22 basemap to get the car started
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Old 07-05-2011, 10:12 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
YOU CANNOT USE SMANAGER WITH CROME.

you use MOATES HARDWARE with CROME SOFTWARE.

stop talking out of your ass.
you CAN make one chip with crome and another with smanager ;)

no need to "yell".
if you dont tune it yourself, you dont need to buy any software or hardware (or do you have some stupid laws over there?)

Last edited by TypeT; 07-05-2011 at 10:15 AM.
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Old 07-05-2011, 10:23 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
with crome....no. because its freeware.

other programs which are BETTER than crome, are not free and require either buying the hardware or purchasing a license.
Do I get this right: so you need license there for the tuner that he can tune your car

Dont really know US laws, but here its much simpler than that
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Old 07-05-2011, 10:33 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
ugh. It's a one time license you must pay the tuner in order for him to tune your car with DEALER neptune and ectune software. This way you dont have to purchase hardware. You just buy the license and we can burn the map onto a chip just like crome.
ok, here arent that kind of license things
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:45 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
ugh. It's a one time license you must pay the tuner in order for him to tune your car with DEALER neptune and ectune software. This way you dont have to purchase hardware. You just buy the license and we can burn the map onto a chip just like crome.

Don't even waste your breath man.. This guy is not trying to listen and learn anything... In one ear out the other
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Old 07-06-2011, 10:55 AM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

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Don't even waste your breath man.. This guy is not trying to listen and learn anything... In one ear out the other
Dont really care about US laws... useless information for me
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Old 07-06-2011, 05:40 PM
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Re: cams or tb+intake mani?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 98vtec View Post
YOU CANNOT USE SMANAGER WITH CROME.

you use MOATES HARDWARE with CROME SOFTWARE.

stop talking out of your ass.



Just like how you periodically get software upgrades from Microsoft, I am just waiting for the day that starts happening with cars. Just like Windows 2000 for example, you will have Honda 2012 or maybe even something really weired like Electronic Arts 2012. I get regular software updates by USB port for my Garman GPS. I am certain one one day it will happen with cars. Its just a matter of time and then the advantage all these software guru's have over the masses will then be marginalized.
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