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question for those who have had oil burning issues

 
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Old 08-20-2010, 06:29 PM
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question for those who have had oil burning issues

i recently bought a 98 base . heres the deal ive built quite a few h22s but ive never had a problem with one that burnt oil . im wondering if anyone here has had this issue and gone the route of putting in new pistons and rings ( looking at getting a set of NIPPON type s replicas ) heres the question . do these rings score the cyc walls ( necessitating mashine work ) or is it normally a oil ring issue ? im trying to decide if i should just buy another motor to build in the next few weeks ( if its gonna need machine work im trying to have minimal down time ) i might as well get another motor put pistons rods cams and the whole shabang and just do it all in one shot . i know there is no for sure answer until i get the head off just wondering what others here have experianced in the past . i just wonder if for now i can slap pistons and rings in and resolve the issue . im about to have a kid in a month and im not trying to spend money unless i have to . if i can get away with a piston and ring slap for now id like to . if not im gonna go for broke and do the whole motor head and all . i was planning on a build anyway just not so soon .. any help would be greatly appreciated .. thanks in advance
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Old 08-20-2010, 07:08 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

Before you go through the hassle I would first do a compression test and a leakdown test. See if and where you are losing pressure. It may be that you just need to adjust your valves or something. Also I don't think there is any other way to check for scoring unless you pull the pistons and look.


Thats my two cents, although I really don't know much about the subject so you may want to wait til someone more knowledgeable chimes in.
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Old 08-20-2010, 07:55 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

pistons rings usually do not score up the cylinder walls, with age and many heat cycles they deform and become "leaky" meaning they form tiny holes between the ring and the wall allowing oil to find its way past the rings.
In your situation I would replace PCV valve, look into oil catch-can setups, and maybe use thicker oil in the mean time to see if your problem resolves.
Do you have smoke coming out of your tail pipe ?
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Old 08-20-2010, 10:03 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

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Originally Posted by havikprelude View Post
Before you go through the hassle I would first do a compression test and a leakdown test. See if and where you are losing pressure. It may be that you just need to adjust your valves or something. Also I don't think there is any other way to check for scoring unless you pull the pistons and look.


Thats my two cents, although I really don't know much about the subject so you may want to wait til someone more knowledgeable chimes in.
already have done both . 3 % on 1 2 3 10 % on 4 compression is equal across the board .
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Old 08-20-2010, 10:09 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

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Originally Posted by street_ride14 View Post
pistons rings usually do not score up the cylinder walls, with age and many heat cycles they deform and become "leaky" meaning they form tiny holes between the ring and the wall allowing oil to find its way past the rings.
In your situation I would replace PCV valve, look into oil catch-can setups, and maybe use thicker oil in the mean time to see if your problem resolves.
Do you have smoke coming out of your tail pipe ?


in vtec i do see some oil smoke . it already has a new pcv its not going that route anyway its actually getting sucked by the rings . i think this is a little past using a thicker oil . its using about half a quart a week ( 400 miles ) . in my past experiance with other motors usually just a worn out oil ring that causes this . i just find it funny its only one cyc . i think i am just gonna buy another motor and build it up . just keep tossing oil in as needed for now . would be a fun weekend prodject to just be able to toss in a set of 11to 1 pistons . already have a neo and a place to tune it . just would hate to open it up and see that it needs more than a hone
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Old 08-21-2010, 12:01 AM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

as far as what the problem is i already know the oil ring is not doing its job on the number 4 cyc and the rings arnt quite up to par on the down stroke either ( 10 % leakage ) but they seem to seal fine under compression and combustion stroke hence equal compression across the board . just wondering if anyone has had this issue and what the results were when you pulled the head . if its common to have scoring on the cyc wall or not . by the way i am an ase mechanic so i have the bases covered ( i do appreciate the input guys i do ) just want to know what others have seen when they crack it open
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:41 AM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

as you may already know With the exception of a few oddballs, including the H22A, most Honda engines use cast-iron cylinder liners. Unlike cast iron, FRM is a metal-matrix composite made from carbon fiber and aluminum oxide, both high-end materials. The benefits of FRM as opposed to cast iron include improved heat transferring from the cylinders to the water jackets, higher wear resistance, and less weight. FRM allows designers to keep engine package and cooling system sizes minimal since heat-transfer properties are better, but Honda didn't exactly do that with the H22A. Instead of making the block smaller, which would in turn decrease the cooling system's jackets and port dimensions, Honda kept it the same, which means FRM-lined H22As are potentially more efficient in terms of cooling than cast-iron-lined engines, which means, in theory, they'll last longer. FRM is ceramic based, like spark plug insulators, so it's more durable than cast iron and theoretically has a longer service life. Theoretically. There's nothing wrong with FRM liners, that is, until you get into a buildup, and even then they're not so bad. The problem lies not just with the liners but the pistons. Honda developed special gravity-cast, aluminum-alloy pistons with specific expansion rates that work in an FRM environment. FRM liners expand more than cast-iron ones, which means the pistons have got to account for the expansion. Most aftermarket forged pistons are manufactured for use with cast-iron liners, which means popping a set in an FRM block can spell serious problems. None of this is really that big of a deal anymore though. A few piston manufacturers offer FRM-compatible forged pistons and ring sets and, if that doesn't float your boat, you can always sleeve the block with ductile iron sleeves, which you'd end up needing anyway if you're shooting for big numbers.

(quoted from Honda Tuning)



to answer your question, FRM is some good stuff, its very hard to damage the walls unless you have a serious break down.
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Old 08-21-2010, 09:52 AM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

i appreciate the response thats what i was looking for . i guess i will be ordering a set of pistons today and next weekend we will have a 11 to 1 compression motor . thanks for all the input guys anyone elses experiances would be great appreciated also .. thanks guys
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Old 08-21-2010, 02:48 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

same thing was happening with me. so i just used thicker oil and it's been fine so far
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Old 08-21-2010, 05:10 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

how thick we talking ??
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Old 09-05-2010, 01:58 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

10w40
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Old 09-05-2010, 03:53 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

problem solved . h23a vtec a few other misc parts and obd2 to 1 with p28 . the real fun begins now lol .
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Old 09-05-2010, 03:57 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

are you planning on going 11:1 w/ the stock FRM sleeves?
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Old 09-05-2010, 04:29 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

no i bought the h23a vtec and im leaving it stock at 10.6 to 1 . i dont want to touch this h23a and its balanced rotating assembly . i did however run 11.1 on my old h22a for years with the frm sleeves with no issues . have people had issues doing so ? and if so isnt the type s 11 to 1 with the same sleeves ??
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Old 09-05-2010, 04:45 PM
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Re: question for those who have had oil burning issues

yes, but forged pistons don't do well w/ the FRM sleeves, as I'm sure you know.
even the type s pistons will eventually have the same problem as the usdm slugs. you will have ring flutter and oil blow by.

good choice of motors btw.
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