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Old 05-08-2014, 12:45 AM
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Icon5 stock MAP question

Hi people!

stock low mile f22 block, recently resleeved, 8.8 comp.
ported and polished head
cai and exhaust
Was running 40shot of juice for half yeah

150 whp may be

Wanna blow in 5 or 6 psi max
elevation is 8500 feet (11.8psi atm pressure approx)

so, my question is. Would the stock map be capable of reading and managing that small amount of positive pressure? I'm gonna use h22 injectors and raised fuel pressure

Thank you guys
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Old 05-08-2014, 10:08 AM
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Re: stock MAP question

I used a stock MAP for 10psi.
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1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


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But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-08-2014, 11:40 AM
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Re: stock MAP question

So stock map can satisfy fi needs till what pressure? How will my elevation affect it? If we have here 11.8 psi say it, if I boost 6, the absolute manifold pressure will be 18? So technically I can boost more! Or the elevation plays negative role due to pressure difference!

I'm sorry looks like you have a plenty of experience with fi so I hope you can help me with my setup. I got a lot of questions. What injector I should usein my case?
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Old 05-08-2014, 01:32 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

Stock can hold about 10-11psi of boost (1.7bar'ish TOTAL). I was at the max, but was fine.

So MY atm pressure, for all intents and purposes, "at sea level" (relative to you) = 1 bar/14.6psi. Leaving another .7bar/10.22psi for boost.
But your atm of 11.8psi leaves more headroom for boost, around 13psi.

At least I'm almost positive that's how it works, a tuner would know better than I.
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1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


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But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-08-2014, 07:01 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

What rate injectors was you using for 10psi? What fuel pressure,what pump! It would be good to have some data as a reference.
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Old 05-08-2014, 09:28 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

:::twokexlv6coupe::: 1995 SE-T

BB2F22T3super60 dyno-tuned!!!
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1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


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But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-09-2014, 06:22 AM
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Re: stock MAP question

Thanks!
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Old 05-10-2014, 09:25 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

I have few questions:

1. Not too small compressor with integrated wastegate. I was thinking of just blocking it and using an external one. Can I?
2. 5 or 6 psi of boost. Where must I plumb a port to send a pressure to wastegate actuator? near compressor outlet? Before throttle body? I'm going to use stock 4 - 1 header. Must I port it? Wastegate and turbine will be attached to the custom made curved downpipe. distance between compressor to where the header ends. its one meter aprox.
3. Blow off valve... if wg is set to open at,say it, 6 psi, how must I set a bov opening pressure!
4. Where is the best place to locate a hose tube for the boost gauge?
5. Kinda more stupid then others. :$ I have a diy wet n2o injection system that works with 6 psi measured fuel pressure. a fogger is calibrated to work at 6 psi no more no less. how will it work at full boost! If I got, say , 4 psi of absolute positive pressure in the intake under full boost, wouldn't it affect the fogger fuel output? 6Psi - 4psi =2psi. so, the fogger will only inject at 2psi? Hope I'm not right...
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Last edited by aqprider; 05-10-2014 at 09:45 PM.
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Old 05-10-2014, 10:15 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

1) Yup, just weld the internal wastegate flap shut.
2) My compressor already had a barbed fitting on it, so I used that for my w/g source. But using an N/A header as a turbo manifold isn't a good idea; the thin walled tubing wasn't designed to hold a ~35lb turbo hanging off it.
3) Only certain BOV's are adjustable, and you only need to adjust it if you're getting compressor surge, which shouldn't really happen w/ a quality bov. My HKS SSQV wasn't adjustable, but my TurboXS RFL is.
4) Boost gauge source is all personal. If you use the turbo, you'll be seeing exactly what psi the turbo is pushing. If you do the TB, you'll be seeing exactly what psi the engine is.

I honestly have no idea about nitrous, couldn't help you there.
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1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brash View Post
But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:32 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

Thank you!
Is flap this small valve inside?

Well, in my case is not a header where the turbo is mounted, but the downpipe. which is custom made 2.5 not so thin pipe. pipe goes sideways after the header then up,there is where a turbo will be placed,then the pipe goes down again and converts into exhaust. However, there will be some extra support for the turbo, so it won't relay just on the pipe with all its weight.

now,wastegate outlet,should I connect it to exhaust after the turbine or better let it to vent through separate exhaust just for wg? Which solution is better?

do you know a typical opening pressures of bov? Sorry I'm a little confused about my understanding of how bov works

Last question isn't about nitrous, its more about general physics. imagine you have a pipe with 11.7 + 6 psi of absolute pressure within... will the jet which pumps in fuel at 6psi at 11.8 pressure in the pipe iprovide the same flow rate in this pipe when it has 17.8psi internal pressure?
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Old 05-12-2014, 01:07 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

Yea the round flap with an arm on it. And as long as you don't have any hoses hooked up to the w/g, it won't try to open.

Pics of this manifold? Sounds interesting.

W/G outlet is preference. Routed back into the exhaust is quieter, if you're going for a sleeper, but if not routed correctly could potentially hurt performance.
Open W/G is louder, and potentially more powerful. I've had both setups on the 'lude, and honestly can't believe I haven't gone to an open W/G yet on the subby (mainly because it involves a new up-pipe, turbo, wastegate, AND downpipe )

BOV's open under VACUUM, not pressure As soon as the TB is closed and starts creating a vacuum in the IM the BOV opens.

If the fogger is tapped into a fuel pressure line, isn't the amount of boost completely irrelevant?
If the fuel pressure is <6psi, the fogger isn't switched open. If the fuel pressure is >6psi, the fogger is switched open but only sprays 6psi? Yes no?
__________________

1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brash View Post
But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-13-2014, 12:06 AM
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Re: stock MAP question

FINALLY with internet connection, it's so incomfortable to write posts from fkn android device!

Quote:
Yea the round flap with an arm on it. And as long as you don't have any hoses hooked up to the w/g, it won't try to open.
so it isn't so necessary to weld it shut??

Quote:
Pics of this manifold? Sounds interesting.
soon. I'm fabricating it

Quote:
Open W/G is louder
No, I don't want a sleeper, so I'm going open)))

Quote:
BOV's open under VACUUM, not pressure As soon as the TB is closed and starts creating a vacuum in the IM the BOV opens.
BOV is connected to plenum via vacuum line? behind TB? then, vacuum from plenum opens the BOV located BEFORE the TB? so it's how it works?

Quote:
If the fogger is tapped into a fuel pressure line, isn't the amount of boost completely irrelevant?
fogger is feeding from it's OWN low pressure line (powered from low pressure 6psi pump)

Quote:
If the fuel pressure is <6psi, the fogger isn't switched open. If the fuel pressure is >6psi, the fogger is switched open but only sprays 6psi? Yes no?
The fogger is activated when I activate nitrous, by a button. So it's closed always, just opens when I'm spraying. And as I spray at >4000rpm, so there I would be on boost, with positive pressure in the intake? Won't it create backpressure for the fogger?

Sorry, I had D in phisycs at high school :$
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:49 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

UP!

Here it goes>

1. Would stock oil pump bring enough oil pressure and flow for turbo setup?
2. Anybody knows what temp do exhaust gases have 3 feet after the header (engine under full load)?
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Old 05-19-2014, 03:58 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

Quote:
Originally Posted by aqprider View Post
FINALLY with internet connection, it's so incomfortable to write posts from fkn android device!



so it isn't so necessary to weld it shut??

yes it still is, cuz gases could escape past the flap if you don't weld it.


BOV is connected to plenum via vacuum line? behind TB? then, vacuum from plenum opens the BOV located BEFORE the TB? so it's how it works?

yes, behind TB, exactly.

fogger is feeding from it's OWN low pressure line (powered from low pressure 6psi pump)

The fogger is activated when I activate nitrous, by a button. So it's closed always, just opens when I'm spraying. And as I spray at >4000rpm, so there I would be on boost, with positive pressure in the intake? Won't it create backpressure for the fogger?

Doubtful, plenty of other ppl spraying on boost. Dom Torreto, for one



Quote:
Originally Posted by aqprider View Post
1. Would stock oil pump bring enough oil pressure and flow for turbo setup?

Yes, if anything, it provides TOO much, needing a restrictor in the feed line.

2. Anybody knows what temp do exhaust gases have 3 feet after the header (engine under full load)?

i've seen ~1100 celcius, but my EGT probe is around 6 inches from the engine.

__________________

1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brash View Post
But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-19-2014, 07:48 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

Thanks for your answers man, youre helping me a lot

Quote:
Doubtful, plenty of other ppl spraying on boost. Dom Torreto, for one
perhaps he has his fuel system stuck in a separate fuel circuit just for nitrous fed by walbro 255, so he donīt care about pressure difference and that stuff. Itīs īcause heīs Toretto.)))

Quote:
yes it still is
fail. Finally I got just a wastegateless one. So I got to save money for an external wg now

Quote:
Yes, if anything, it provides TOO much, needing a restrictor in the feed line.
what diameter is the restrictor I would need?

Two of my biggest fears:

1. To fry my oil in the turbo because of lack of flow and destroy my both turbo and my low end, like splitting my crankshaft in two.
2. To split my low end in two by letting too much oil go to the turbo, leaving the low end without oil.
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Last edited by aqprider; 05-19-2014 at 07:58 PM.
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Old 05-19-2014, 10:19 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

2 cranks > 1

and 4 cams > 2

The turbo's manufacturer should be able to tell you if a restrictor is needed for that turbo on that engine

Does my turbo require an oil restrictor | Turbobygarrett



The entire TurboByGarrett TurboTech 101-303 are all extremely informative reads, I'd highly suggest reading them all.
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1995 Honda Prelude SE Turbo; 250whp, 275wtq @ 10psi Soldddd!!!

2000 Acura TL; DD
2005 Stage2.5+ Subaru WRB STi : RzKar!
Ivey Tuned - Advan - Cobb - Rallispec - CP - Perrin - ACT - KillerB - Carillo - TurboXS - Defi - Innovate - Walbro - DeatschWerks - Feal - H&R - Alpine - Infiniti - Curt

2001 Kawasaki STX1100 D.I. - Sold!
2007 Sea-Doo RXT 215; ET 127 +3 S/C impeller, DIY 3" intake, DIY resonator delete/free flow exhaust, DIY oil catch can, Rule 500gph bilge pump


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brash View Post
But you need that scoop on the hood. Is it true that they're big enough to fit your lunch box and all your camera gear in it?
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Old 05-19-2014, 10:51 PM
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Re: stock MAP question

Quote:
2 cranks > 1

and 4 cams > 2
sorry, I didn't understood that. I tried to guess and I'm very scared of my thoughts... (((
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