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In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

 
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Old 05-06-2018, 10:00 PM
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Icon9 In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Is there anyone out there that knows their stuff when it comes to troubleshooting issues with preludes? I have a 1999 prelude that I just bought a motor for. It's an h22a5, I swapped everything over it needs (basically the same as h22a swap) I replaced the water pump, timing belt, head gasket, intake and exhaust manifold gaskets, accessory belts, fuel injector seals, coolant lines, plugs, wires, cap and rotor, fuel filter... a lot more that I cant remember of the top of my head. When I try to start it the car fires and tries to run for a second but dies. Occasionally it will run for 10 seconds but roughly and dies again. I checked the plugs and they have carbon build up so something isn't right. I'm not sure if I have the vacuum lines hooked up correctly though. Any kind of information would be greatly appreciated. I need to get my car back on the road!

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Old 05-07-2018, 12:41 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

did you adjust valves correctly? triple check timing
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Old 05-07-2018, 08:29 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

triple check everything. If you are 100000000000% sure timing and valves are on point, Floor the accelerator while cranking. You should have also cleaned out EGR while you had intake manifold off, if you haven't done that already.

Do you have fresh gas?
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Old 05-07-2018, 08:30 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

For the 10 seconds that it does run how does it sound? Does it sound normal? What does it sound like when it dies? Did you do a compression test?
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Old 05-07-2018, 09:10 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I'll have to check the timing again and yes the valves were adjusted correctly. I read it could be overly retarded timing possibly but again I'll have to check. And when it does run it sounds good but i have to step on the gas to keep it running and besides that it seems to run rough like it's missing. Maybe detonation is too late?
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:56 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I'll make sure I check timing and valves again. I don't have fresh gas, it's been sitting a few months but I did spray some starting fluid in just to see and it does the same thing
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Old 05-08-2018, 12:28 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

also double check wires and sensors
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Old 05-08-2018, 03:22 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Did you clean out FITV and IAVC?
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Old 05-10-2018, 07:14 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Fuel pump?
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I remember my first thread, asking what a noise was when I got going 110mph.
Pretty much got flamed for driving like a jackass and was told to slow down. And I'll be damned, slowing down fixed it.

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Old 05-10-2018, 07:33 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I have one square connector that I'm not sure of where it goes. It branches from the thermostat housing sensor and map sensor location. Four slots, three have metal female pieces 8n them. Any ideas?
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Old 05-10-2018, 07:34 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I cleaned the iacv and fitv
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Old 05-10-2018, 09:28 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Why did you replace the motor?

Is it JDM?

Are the plugs new? You mention build up, but if it is noticeable after just a few attempts to start... holy cow that is drastic.

Have you downloaded a service manual from the DIY section Service Manual thread? Tells step by step how to swap a motor.

I only check in a couple times a week, but will lend a hand as much as possible.
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welcome to site Carl
...is a golden car fax kinda like a golden ticket? Sure hope willy wonka didn't put any snozberries in your motor.
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Only seen the first one, 15 years ago in theaters. Plan on keeping it that way. Get off my lawn.
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I remember my first thread, asking what a noise was when I got going 110mph.
Pretty much got flamed for driving like a jackass and was told to slow down. And I'll be damned, slowing down fixed it.

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Old 05-10-2018, 11:51 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

The old motors piston rings went out and I lost compression in cylinder number 1. I bought a h22a5 (euro h22) with 56,000 miles on it. I followed everything for the swap and it came together nicely. I just checked me egr port in my intake manifold and it looks pretty much clogged. Could that be an issue? Thank you bykfixer anything will help.
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Old 05-10-2018, 11:53 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Thank you ematthew and Typet as well lol first time I've been a member of a forum and first post I'm glad to see some good feedback and generosity
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Old 05-11-2018, 02:29 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Man, I regret this place is in a coma lately. Lots of talented folks used to chime into threads like this one. Type T, mat and myself are some of the few remaining 'post-ers' anymore.

To check the egr situation try opening up the throttle a bit. There is a screw on the throttle body on the passenger side that will let in more air.

Also, for now (if you haven't already) leave the air filter off while you try to start it. Let in max air flow to gain an understanding if your clogged egr is playing a role.

Mine was a chronic hard to start and I opened up the throttle screw some and that helped. Also solved my idle issue where letting off the gas caused the idle to drop too much and the car would stall.

Maybe Wings8806 will pop in... that guy is an absolute freakin' genious with these cars. (No offense mat and T, but he knows these babies inside and out... like his brain is connected to the ecu or something)
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welcome to site Carl
...is a golden car fax kinda like a golden ticket? Sure hope willy wonka didn't put any snozberries in your motor.
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Only seen the first one, 15 years ago in theaters. Plan on keeping it that way. Get off my lawn.
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Originally Posted by Lindso View Post
I remember my first thread, asking what a noise was when I got going 110mph.
Pretty much got flamed for driving like a jackass and was told to slow down. And I'll be damned, slowing down fixed it.

God's Not Dead

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Old 05-12-2018, 10:46 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.







Ok, here is the list of stuff my son used to install a JDM motor in his 01. Take note of things like the crank position sensor swap etc, as the US motor speaks to the US ecm in US language versus your euro engine that may not.

It could be that there is a language barrier in the computer telling the engine to do certain things incorrectly.

If there is a way to post a photo of that leftover plug from about 3' away from the engine we may be able to look at a diagram in the service manual to figure out where it goes. I had an 'extra' one on my H22 for an SH model that turns out was meant for use on auto tranny cars... yup, the harness for the SH included a plug for the auto tranny.... an option not available on the SH model
(Edit: its the plug for the atts in my case. End edit)

Did you swap the distrubutor from your old motor? Crank position sensor? etc etc?
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welcome to site Carl
...is a golden car fax kinda like a golden ticket? Sure hope willy wonka didn't put any snozberries in your motor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elspectro29 View Post
Only seen the first one, 15 years ago in theaters. Plan on keeping it that way. Get off my lawn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindso View Post
I remember my first thread, asking what a noise was when I got going 110mph.
Pretty much got flamed for driving like a jackass and was told to slow down. And I'll be damned, slowing down fixed it.

God's Not Dead

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Old 05-12-2018, 01:11 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

So the OBD I h22a5 is much like the h22a. Oil pump housing + TDC & CKP sensor, distributor, alternator, ignition coil, thermostat housing, 5th gen obd2 engine wiring harness, alternator bracket, the knock sensor, the timing and balance belt sprockets, intake manifold, throttle body, and injectorshave all been swapped from my a4 to the a5. I got the egr port cleaned out now then it threw a code for the crank position sensor. So while I was down there swapping those out I checked my timing again and it seems to be in time. Put it all back together last night andit seems to want to start more now, actually kind of idled just fine once for 10 seconds before shutting down again. But now it tries to fire with every cycle so replacing the sensor helped a little bit. I'm losing this battle right now unfortunately lol.
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Old 05-12-2018, 02:10 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I really wish I had more info from someone e who has done an a4 yo a5 swap. Everything I've read is that they're the same with a different compression ratio. Maybe I need the euro ecu?
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Old 05-12-2018, 10:08 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

This is a tough one to say for sure. Info seems to be really lacking with the A5. As far as I could read the only major differences differences between the two many people SPECULATE on are the ECU (this is where some say the power loss comes from, it was detuned to be placed in a lower tax bracket or something but this could all be BS) and I read on another sight that the main bearings can sometimes vary in size between 50-55mm depending on the year.

But I digress, I got lucky and managed to do the timing right with my car the times I've done the timing service (its hard to get the belt in the proper location with the two cam gears wanting to fight you) but once with a friends civic, we had the timing belt off by one tooth after a water pump change and it did exactly what yours did. It would run for a very short period and die, wouldn't stay running. You said you already checked your timing again and again though so I guess your good there... just make sure your positive your not off even ONE tooth because its really easy to do.

Maybe I missed it earlier in the thread but did you check that your cylinders all have decent compression? You are getting decent fuel pressure in the fuel rail? Good spark? Just throwing out ideas as I'm not sure what it could be.

For your other thread- as far as I know you'd have to swap everything else back to use the original ECU as it uses the other dizzy etc.
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Old 05-13-2018, 09:46 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Ok, basic stuff here:
Do the plugs smell like gas? Are you drying them between starts? Plugs can drown as it is the fumes that light in gasoline then the explosion burns the liquid.

Check the connectors at the spark points and fuel points. Make sure ALL ground points are clean, clean, clean and the connector on wires (as well as the fastenter screws) are corrosion free. Honda ground are fickle that way.

I'll say it again, open up the idle adjustment screw on the throttle body some. It will relieve some vacuum build up as it cranks over.

It sounds like it is just a matter of figuring out where the gremlin is lurking. All the things you've done should have worked, but obviously something aint. To me it sounds like it could be something very simple hiding somewhere but just hasn't reared its ugly head yet.

It sounds like your work has the euro motor speaking USDM to your USDM ecu so that shouldn't be the issue imo.
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Originally Posted by ogsmakdade View Post
welcome to site Carl
...is a golden car fax kinda like a golden ticket? Sure hope willy wonka didn't put any snozberries in your motor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elspectro29 View Post
Only seen the first one, 15 years ago in theaters. Plan on keeping it that way. Get off my lawn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindso View Post
I remember my first thread, asking what a noise was when I got going 110mph.
Pretty much got flamed for driving like a jackass and was told to slow down. And I'll be damned, slowing down fixed it.

God's Not Dead
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Old 05-15-2018, 06:29 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

New update, it's getting taken to my buddy's shop so they can run diagnostics on it. Hopefully we figure it out soon, I'll keep you all updated! Thanks for everything!
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Old 05-17-2018, 02:30 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I suppose i'm a little late to the party. Haven't been on since January.

Feel free to shoot me a PM with a photo of the spare connector, and we can run through everything once more if you'd like. Although I see you've already taken the car to a shop.
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Old 06-01-2018, 09:43 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Okay I finally got it back. They said the timing belt was off a tooth, fixed it, but it's doing the same thing except it wants to start a little more. Mechanic said it's a fuel pressure issue/old gas... it's only been sitting for 6 months though. Could the gas have gone bad in that span of time? My fuel pressure was fine before when I had the old motor in it. I replaced the fuel filter today and still nothing. They sprayed some starting fluid in it and they said it ran and idles for a while until they went to step on the gas and bogged out. Any ideas guys? I'm losing my damn mind and cant afford to pay the mechanics again.
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Old 06-03-2018, 02:58 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

distributor side things ok?
valves adjusted correctly?
sensors working and wired right?
injectors not clogged?

6 months old fuel shouldnt be the problem if the tank has been full so theres no change of (condensation) water been mixed to your fuel
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Old 06-03-2018, 10:18 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

6 month old gas should not be a problem. But if practical, put in another gallon of fresh gasoline.

Now a friend of mine was attempting to find a similar issue a long time ago. He had my brother turn the key and bump the starter a couple seconds while he held a glass bottle over the end of the fuel line. No fuel pumped out, but the pump was pumping. In his case it was a perferated suction hose below the pump letting in air.

That would not be the case with the Prelude.


I have circled part numbers for things it might be.

https://www.hondapartsnow.com/parts-...fuel-tank.html
The link is to hondapartsnow where it describes each part and shows the part number.

I did not come across other models that use this fuel pump unfortunately.

Try this trick:
Have a freind turn the key forward while you hold one end of a metal pipe against your ear and the other against the fuel tank. When the key is turned to where your dash lights up you should hear the fuel pump click and hum.

I circled other parts it may be as well, such as the fuel valve that may be malfunctioning or the incoming filter set prior to the fuel pump. Honda placed a filter set to stop debris from entering the fuel pump. It could be that simple. Or it could be that a critter made a home inside the motor end of the fuel line one night while your motor was out. It happens.

It sounds like your car is starved for fuel now for whatever reason.

Hope this helps.

Edit: my son tells me there are some aftermarket fuel pumps available these days. End edit.
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Originally Posted by ogsmakdade View Post
welcome to site Carl
...is a golden car fax kinda like a golden ticket? Sure hope willy wonka didn't put any snozberries in your motor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elspectro29 View Post
Only seen the first one, 15 years ago in theaters. Plan on keeping it that way. Get off my lawn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindso View Post
I remember my first thread, asking what a noise was when I got going 110mph.
Pretty much got flamed for driving like a jackass and was told to slow down. And I'll be damned, slowing down fixed it.

God's Not Dead

Last edited by bykfixer; 06-03-2018 at 02:19 PM.
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Old 06-03-2018, 07:39 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I got a new fuel pump, put new gas in, adjusted valves, checked my dizzy, sensors seem to be in working order, injectors arent clogged. The worst part is that after having the mechanic look at it it still doesn't run. I'm starting to doubt he did the timing but I'm not sure. Can anyone tell me how to attach a video so you can see and hear what's goi g on? Or does anyone have a Facebook or something of the like I can direct message a video to?
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Old 06-03-2018, 11:46 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I sprayed a little bit of starting fluid in the intake, started and ran just fine with a couple backfires. Sat there and idles for 10 mins before I stepped on the gas a bit and it wouldnt rev past 3200 rpms. The speedometer moved up to 15 mph at 3200 rpms as well. But it didn't die after letting off. Soon as I shut it off and tried to start it again it wouldnt start. Not sure what it means?
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Old 06-04-2018, 12:35 AM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

limp mode - check the codes
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Honda Prelude 1997 2.2 VTI

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Old 06-04-2018, 05:26 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

I scanned the engine and it came up with P0335 for the crankshaft position sensor. However, I already replaced the sensor with a brand new one.
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Old 06-04-2018, 08:13 PM
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Re: In search of help, 5th gen no start after timing belt replacement.

Double check the wire to it.

If I recall correct the main belt is pretty close to it. When I helped my son install an H23 I ziptied it away from the belts thinking it may snag or rub causing the power to the sensor to be cut, or unplugged...

I'll see if I can find a photo...


About mid way in the photo you can see the plug.
The photo was laying on the ground looking up.
I forget exactly what I was worried it may snag on but his H23 timing belt cover had no place to fasten the keeper thereby preventing it from snagging.

Check the wires going into both sides of the plug too. Sometimes a wire will break at the point in goes into the plug.

If that's the case, it's not hard to fix, just takes a small precision scewdriver to work the pin out of the plug, then a new pin inserted into the plug with the wire crimped into the new pin. I'll step you through it if it turns out to be a broken wire....


I did a door plug once
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Last edited by bykfixer; 06-04-2018 at 08:33 PM.
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