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Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

 
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Old 08-15-2017, 07:45 PM
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Icon7 Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

Hello everybody,

Would like some help because I’m not really a car guru. But I’ve been learning a lot recently.
Been in love with this prelude since I got it 1 year ago… It was actually in good condition and had no issues at the time.

Multiple issues..
Whenever I accelerate, and then let of the gas/accelerator, my vehicle always jerks like I'm dragging something behind me or somebody is pulling my car back. It is very significant in 1st or 2nd gear when I'm in low speeds, but can still be felt even in all the other gears even on higher speeds. I feel like other vehicles will just roll more naturally so I don't have to keep pressing the accelerator. Its just a very unnatural feel like something is wrong. Even my friend’s Subaru WRX rolls so smoothly on 1st/2nd gear. I also feel like my car is not as fast as it should in terms of acceleration. I feel like I have to use higher RPM just to keep up with other cars in the road everyday from the stoplight. I am also only getting like 18-20mpg on suburban Georgia. Not city traffic, not a lot of hills. Lots of 35-50mph roads. I'm not usually on stop and go traffic either.

The car also idles very very low. Like 200 to 400 rpm... The needle also seems bounce very little bit around that range. Also when I have the A/C on, there are random bounces where the rpm would get so low its like the power wants to cut off (I will see the gauge light flicker very fast and hear the A/C running). At first start after the car has sat a while, the RPS idles at around 1200 rpm... and the idle doesn't drop to that 300/400 range until I actually drive the car and then stop somewhere and see it.

When I still had an automatic, and right after I installed the skunk2 megapower (with a new catalytic converter) after traveling around 70 miles I started getting knock sensor codes. Whats funny is they were very inconsistent. I would continue to drive with no problems.
We reset the code, and no knock sensor issues until like a week later. It was so random.... I went to deploy for 6 months while he did the manual swap. But due to the p28 ECU we got, I don't think we will get any more knock sensor notifications. So I was concerned that could be the problem too?

Sometimes, it is also difficult to get into 1st gear from a stoplight. Its very hard to, like I have to really punch the stick. Unless I do the workaround, go 2nd, and then first. Ive had multiple scares as far as reaction time with cars behind me.
I do not think this is normal, and I have not met another person with the same type of prelude to compare... I also seen forums of other people with similar issues but not necessarily the same exact problem. I have also had the “pulling, off of the gas pedal” issue when it was still auto. Honestly I got the tranny swapped thinking it was because of the auto (it was not really failing yet).
Ive had 1 mechanic do all this work on this car. And he's a good friend who is the lead tech in firestone, who also does side business in his house backyard. Gives me good discount prices. He keeps telling me these are all normal, but when I see youtube videos with cockpit view of people driving their ludes, I really feel like mine has a hidden problem.
Prelude 1997 Base - Recently Swapped 2 weeks ago to a manual from a donor car.

-No CEL/Lights
-No White/Black smoke coming from exhaust. Pretty clean other than usual black carbon build up.
-Swapped Tranny from a manual 97 lude
-New master/slave cylinder (during the swap)
-New exedy clutch/flywheel (during the swap)
-Using Honda MTF
-Uses automatic wiring harness. (still cant get reverse light to work)
-Does not have clutch start. I can start as long as I'm in neutral.
-P28 Chipped ECU. The original p13 ECU had to be resoldered, and the manual ECU from the donor car (with the tranny) would not work so I bought this off a friend.
-Cylinder head job, shop did some work to smooth out the metals, my mechanic did all the work otherwise.
-All new gaskets/seals required from that cylinder head job.
-New valve cover gasket set (fel pro).
-Gates Timing belt
-Water Pump
-ARP Studs
-AEM intake
- New o2 sensor x 2
-Bottom part of engine (piston/rings) worked on 3 years ago previous owner. Basically guaranteed the bottom half of the engine is good as new…
- New VSS (Gauge was going wonky at the freeway one time with CEL and code
-Axles
-Tie Rods
-Tien Springs
-KYB Struts
-Skunk2 Megapower exhaust system
-New Catalytic Converter
-New brakes
-Radiator, plus all hoses
-Heater hoses and other vacuums
-Spark plugs, iridium, pretty recent.
-New Headlights/Taillights Spyder
-Front lip
-Viper Alarm system *currently being installed. WIP. So far only the remote locks are working

There are other things we've done I cant remember. Otherwise this car should basically be brand new.... It just doesn't feel smooth.. something is really making it very jerky....


I know I typed a lot. But I hope somebody can help me out with that "pulling back" when letting go of the gas pedal completely. Its really affecting my low speed parking lot driving or uphill driving because it makes me feel like the car will slow down and stop so fast, that it drives me crazy about worrying about the clutch or stalling. The car also just feels so heavy and slow compared to other cars in traffic from a stop light. I feel like my vehicle is revving higher than anybody's just to keep up.

Thanks a lot!
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File Type: jpg prelude.jpg (157 Bytes, 28 views)

Last edited by wasabi4u; 08-15-2017 at 08:10 PM.
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Old 08-16-2017, 12:33 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

hows your maintenance history (ignition-fuel wise etc)?

what map is your ecu using?

sounds like theres something wrong with your clutch/transmission

is your engine mounts ok?

eh and lastly change mechanic - hes just full of BS - he did some mistakes there or cut corners and now when theres problems he doenst want to take responsibility
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Old 08-16-2017, 08:25 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TypeT View Post
hows your maintenance history (ignition-fuel wise etc)?

what map is your ecu using?

sounds like theres something wrong with your clutch/transmission

is your engine mounts ok?

eh and lastly change mechanic - hes just full of BS - he did some mistakes there or cut corners and now when theres problems he doenst want to take responsibility

HI thank you for reply...

Stock injectors
Stock pump
New filter. Actually the old one was still so clean
Fuel regulator stock. In fact I changed it with one from autozone and they gave me horrible ones so I returned it.
Distributor, aftermarket by previous owner. But I had recently replaced. The little rotor inside it.

What else am I missing to list


ECU map.. I text the guy who sold it and he said it's h22 map. He said the tune is not Factory setting and is meant For more power. I know that that in neutral when I Rev it with AC off, it limits at like 4 or 5 rpm. With ac on, it goes past it.

Clutch is new exedy... Hmm.. And transmission issue could be a possibility. What happened is for 750$ we bought donor car from South Carolina and towed it all the way to Georgia 2 hours away. I have written statement the previous owner guarantee he has no trans issue. The prelude will was sitting in his yard but the engine wasnt working but kept all other parts. So I figured is best cause it has all parts I need.

engine mounts. Nothing has prompted me to think the engine mounts are worn. I don't know. How to really check while it is in a garage. But I don't think I have any crazy vibrations while driving. What would be good clues? I also recently replaced some of them but they were kinda cheap....
Also this jerk and suddenly loss of speed after taking foot off gas pedal I've had even with the original auto transmission..

i believe this mechanic is so knowledgeable with his car repairs. But I also believe he is so confident he doesn't realize these small things. He's a very hard worker and has done some things for me even for free. I will have somebody else look.

How about you? With your prelude, you never have jerks whether in slow speed? Like I said 1st gear is worst for me. Because I accelerate a little bit and then it feels like the car slows down too fast after foot off gas pedal. So it's very hard to maintain a stable low speed not requiring clutch or having my foot very slightly on the gas..

Last edited by wasabi4u; 08-16-2017 at 08:42 AM.
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Old 08-16-2017, 11:25 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

All of the manual 5th gens I have driven had a pronounced "nose dive" when coming off the throttle. Even in 5th gear they don't really like to coast in gear. Its either power on, or engine braking.

High RPMs = welcome to the manual Prelude owners club. The gutlessness of the H22 in lower RPMs, with the short gearing of the transmission means you will be revving the tits off of it in around town traffic. It always sounds like you're trying to race people, but in reality, you're just keeping up with a corolla. Perfectly normal. After a while it does get fatiguing though. Also, the high RPMs on the highway get get on your nerves after a while, but it's all part of the beast.

First gear has a lockout if you are trying to slip the shifter in, even at a crawl. I have heard of instances where a bent shift fork has made it difficult for drivers to get into 1, 3, and 5.

Jerking at low speed: I've seen this. If decelerating and leaving it in a high gear, the engine will lug, and, the car will lurch a bit until put into a lower gear. Also the short gearing makes first and second very touchy to throttle inputs when in their "sweet spots". The slightest movement of the throttle, either on or off, makes the car buck like a scalded cat. High rpm + first or second gear sweet spot = violence.

An automatic Prelude is not a yardstick by which all Preludes should be measured. An automatic is like an Accord. Smooth (before they start messing up), economical, comfortable, bland, reasonable, vanilla, watered down, nerdy missionary with the lights off. With a manual transmission, the car comes alive. It allows you to access the fun parts of the powerband, which are a little less refined.
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Old 08-16-2017, 05:49 PM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

not reading all of this but my lude used to do something similar and it ended up being bad motor mounts causing the jerking in that car
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Old 08-17-2017, 12:38 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

bad motor mounts can cause that kind of problems (jerking) little bit too and you can check them just by taking them out one by one

Quote:
Originally Posted by wasabi4u View Post
i believe this mechanic is so knowledgeable with his car repairs. But I also believe he is so confident he doesn't realize these small things.
My point exactly kinda: proud guy, but is not familiar with preludes or hondas and everything supposed to be ok mechanically but he havent realized some small things and he dont want to admit that. Could be, not really cool to say "everything is ok" when you have some problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by wasabi4u View Post
How about you? With your prelude, you never have jerks whether in slow speed? Like I said 1st gear is worst for me. Because I accelerate a little bit and then it feels like the car slows down too fast after foot off gas pedal. So it's very hard to maintain a stable low speed not requiring clutch or having my foot very slightly on the gas..
when I had bad fuel map it kinda did, but now with good map - no/much much less

or then you have some kind of maintenance problem:

Quote:
Originally Posted by TypeT View Post
quick what to do list

usually these things fix bad idle or/and hesitations:

- new spark plugs & wires
- new distributor cap & rotor
- new air/fuel filters
- clean injectors/iacv/egr/fitv
- bleed the coolant
- new pcv
- adjust valves and ignition
- adjust idle from tb's screw and throttle cable
- check does sensors work properly: map, iat and tps (and try calibrating tps)
- then check wires, connectors and hoses

check o2 sensors and vacuum/exhaust leaks (check all the seals - IM/header/TB gaskets, injector seals, maybe even buy valve cover gasket set...)
check timing. after that: double check timing

clogged cat might you give some trouble as well (usually when driving) - check cats condition

those are basic maintenance as well.
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Old 08-20-2017, 06:35 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirSSpec View Post
All of the manual 5th gens I have driven had a pronounced "nose dive" when coming off the throttle. Even in 5th gear they don't really like to coast in gear. Its either power on, or engine braking.

High RPMs = welcome to the manual Prelude owners club. The gutlessness of the H22 in lower RPMs, with the short gearing of the transmission means you will be revving the tits off of it in around town traffic. It always sounds like you're trying to race people, but in reality, you're just keeping up with a corolla. Perfectly normal. After a while it does get fatiguing though. Also, the high RPMs on the highway get get on your nerves after a while, but it's all part of the beast.

First gear has a lockout if you are trying to slip the shifter in, even at a crawl. I have heard of instances where a bent shift fork has made it difficult for drivers to get into 1, 3, and 5.

Jerking at low speed: I've seen this. If decelerating and leaving it in a high gear, the engine will lug, and, the car will lurch a bit until put into a lower gear. Also the short gearing makes first and second very touchy to throttle inputs when in their "sweet spots". The slightest movement of the throttle, either on or off, makes the car buck like a scalded cat. High rpm + first or second gear sweet spot = violence.

An automatic Prelude is not a yardstick by which all Preludes should be measured. An automatic is like an Accord. Smooth (before they start messing up), economical, comfortable, bland, reasonable, vanilla, watered down, nerdy missionary with the lights off. With a manual transmission, the car comes alive. It allows you to access the fun parts of the powerband, which are a little less refined.

OK thanks for the info man. It's just hard when comparing my mechanics old 97 civic ex manual he sold or my old automatic 98 accord v6 I sold after getting this car. They just don't jerk like this...
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Old 08-20-2017, 06:43 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TypeT View Post
bad motor mounts can cause that kind of problems (jerking) little bit too and you can check them just by taking them out one by one


My point exactly kinda: proud guy, but is not familiar with preludes or hondas and everything supposed to be ok mechanically but he havent realized some small things and he dont want to admit that. Could be, not really cool to say "everything is ok" when you have some problems



when I had bad fuel map it kinda did, but now with good map - no/much much less

or then you have some kind of maintenance problem:

Definitely not the mounts cause all of them were checked when the transmission was swapped...

It may just be as simple as basic tune ups. I feel like I've done 80% of that list... And it would just be throwing money at the problem. The distributor is definitely one of those I haven't touched since the previous owner. I mean the rotor is new inside it but that's it....

Haven't touched the Iacv / iab...
And also I don't know how to check for vacuum leaks... Any signs?

I also bought new NGK wires and iridium plugs so hopefully those help. I remember the old spark plugs may have gotten wet by oil when the first valve cover gasket blew again after a week, and I remember we may have forgotten to replace the brand new plugs that got wet when we worked on it the second time. Technically they're very very new but got wet my oil. I mean the cylinders were just flooded and you can see the hot liquids.

What's crazy is I don't have any CELS.


New carb Compliant walker cat, basically just drilled on the new skunk 2 exhaust system perfectly with the gaskets.

New hoses in engine bay... Anything that may be brittle from. Age...

Last edited by wasabi4u; 08-20-2017 at 06:45 AM.
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Old 08-21-2017, 12:38 AM
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Re: Prelude 1997 - Jerk/Pull-back when letting go of gas pedal.

if your running just base map it might not work as good as properly tuned one
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