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atts limits?

 
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Old 10-11-2011, 07:08 PM
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atts limits?

I have been looking around this forum for atts info and found out that after a certain amount of hp/torque its does not function anymore. What i didnt find out is if this is whp because im confused.
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:17 PM
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Re: atts limits?

It's measured as a difference in wheel rotation -- power or torque is backed out via calculation. IIRC, it's something on the order of a 10% difference, but check to be sure.
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:47 PM
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Re: atts limits?

I have herd that the limit is 250 hp but keep in mind that even if you had 1000 hp ,their is a limit to how much hp you can effectively use when cornering and that usable limit is probably well below the atts power handling limit . So effectively the possibility of it shutting down while cornering is not a factor unless you nail the throttle in a corner in some inappropriate way that would probably ditch you whether or not the atts is on or off. When the car is experiencing less then .06gs like when your exiting a corner, and/or heading straight, the atts unit normally shuts itself down until you come upon the next corner.Of coarse the ATTS's software is tuned to the torque characteristics of the stock engine and if those operating characteristics are modified in a significant way no telling how well it may perform when it is operating or whether such operation would be safe.
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:47 PM
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Re: atts limits?

it's a tq limit.


if you have the tq limit you can find the whp or bhp limit.
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Old 10-12-2011, 12:28 AM
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Re: atts limits?

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Originally Posted by SHDRIVER View Post
I have herd that the limit is 250 hp but keep in mind that even if you had 1000 hp ,their is a limit to how much hp you can effectively use when cornering and that usable limit is probably well below the atts power handling limit . So effectively the possibility of it shutting down while cornering is not a factor unless you nail the throttle in a corner in some inappropriate way that would probably ditch you whether or not the atts is on or off. When the car is experiencing less then .06gs like when your exiting a corner, and/or heading straight, the atts unit normally shuts itself down until you come upon the next corner.Of coarse the ATTS's software is tuned to the torque characteristics of the stock engine and if those operating characteristics are modified in a significant way no telling how well it may perform when it is operating or whether such operation would be safe.
despite the novel, this is great info. I would have to argue with that fact that whp designates the limits. logically it makes more sense that wtq would be the determining factor. the 250whp theory seems to be just that, a theory. I have not read anywhere that this has been proven firsthand. Push the limit, then let us know when it shuts down.
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Old 10-12-2011, 12:53 AM
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Re: atts limits?

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Originally Posted by wing8806 View Post
it's a tq limit.


if you have the tq limit you can find the whp or bhp limit.

Yes.. Hence aTts

The number that always gets thrown around is 250whp.. People that have had problems with the atts unit prematurley malfunctioning usually have around 250hp and thus it's been associated as the atts units limitations

You shouldnt have a problem with it unless you get boost or do crazy tarded NA build
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Old 10-12-2011, 01:30 PM
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Re: atts limits?

Yeah I've heard that number dished around too but there's nothing to really back it up.

Even so to the OP...250 WHP is quite a bit of power. With some cars, 250 HP at the wheels translates into like 350 HP at the crank. You'd have to get into decently extreme build to see those numbers with a Prelude.
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Old 10-12-2011, 03:44 PM
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Re: atts limits?

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Originally Posted by 98__SH View Post
Yeah I've heard that number dished around too but there's nothing to really back it up.

Even so to the OP...250 WHP is quite a bit of power. With some cars, 250 HP at the wheels translates into like 350 HP at the crank. You'd have to get into decently extreme build to see those numbers with a Prelude.
(Just for future reference)
That is only in a boosted car - there will never be that much of a gap between whp and bhp in something N/A. Unless you're in some crazy automatic awd with horrible drivetrain loss...


and 250whp in a Prelude does not require any kind of extreme build.... cams, valve job, tune for n/a. Or just boost to 9psi and it'll go beyond that... (not boosting an sh obviously, just in general for a prelude)
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Old 10-12-2011, 03:58 PM
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Re: atts limits?

i heard it shuts down because the clutches in the atts unit slip.

nfc if thats accurate tho.

but what ive always wondered.

say its limit is 250 whp is it possible to beef up the atts unit to handle more?
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Old 10-12-2011, 04:12 PM
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Re: atts limits?

no, if you wanted more out of it than just go LSD
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Old 10-12-2011, 05:46 PM
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Re: atts limits?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 98__SH View Post
Yeah I've heard that number dished around too but there's nothing to really back it up.

Even so to the OP...250 WHP is quite a bit of power. With some cars, 250 HP at the wheels translates into like 350 HP at the crank. You'd have to get into decently extreme build to see those numbers with a Prelude.
I dunno what kind of cars you're thinking of that have a 40% loss in the drivetrain. That's some pretty serious business. A more realistic number would be 285hp at the crank.
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Old 10-12-2011, 06:31 PM
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Re: atts limits?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wing8806 View Post
(Just for future reference)
That is only in a boosted car - there will never be that much of a gap between whp and bhp in something N/A. Unless you're in some crazy automatic awd with horrible drivetrain loss...


and 250whp in a Prelude does not require any kind of extreme build.... cams, valve job, tune for n/a. Or just boost to 9psi and it'll go beyond that... (not boosting an sh obviously, just in general for a prelude)
how do you not figure that? NA and boost have nothing to do with drivetrain loss at all.
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Old 10-12-2011, 06:51 PM
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Re: atts limits?

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Originally Posted by UPSluder View Post
how do you not figure that? NA and boost have nothing to do with drivetrain loss at all.
Yep, its FWD, RWD, AWD, and auto or manual tranny that have the most to do with it.
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Old 10-12-2011, 06:57 PM
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Re: atts limits?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UPSluder View Post
how do you not figure that? NA and boost have nothing to do with drivetrain loss at all.
He can Google, but he can't come up with any real info on his own. LOL.
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Old 10-12-2011, 08:16 PM
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Re: atts limits?

Anyways..

I think there's 1 main problem with making over 250 and keeping the ATTS.. And that's the ecu.. Once you start making real horsepower you are gonna have to tune it.. And you're gonna have to ditch the obd2 ecu.. Once you start making a lot of horsepower it's gonna be hard for the atts to handle all that torque anyway

Get a helical LSD
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Old 10-13-2011, 03:07 AM
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Re: atts limits?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UPSluder View Post
how do you not figure that? NA and boost have nothing to do with drivetrain loss at all.
For some reason I was thinking tq while reading/writing bhp. we all make mistakes lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by keeganhmorgan View Post
Yep, its FWD, RWD, AWD, and auto or manual tranny that have the most to do with it.
Exactly. Depending on if it's fwd/awd/rwd or auto/manual expect anywhere from a 10% to 25% drivetrain loss. I've heard alot of evo owners say theirs is about 18% but i think it's more...

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Originally Posted by Phantom240 View Post
He can Google, but he can't come up with any real info on his own. LOL.

I hope you're not referring to me...

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Originally Posted by 00CDMLUDER View Post
Anyways..

Once you start making a lot of horsepower it's gonna be hard for the atts to handle all that torque anyway
That's exactly why I said it's a tq limit. The atts will have trouble handling it.

Last edited by wing8806; 10-13-2011 at 03:24 AM.
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Old 10-13-2011, 09:17 AM
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Re: atts limits?

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Old 10-13-2011, 09:49 AM
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Re: atts limits?

yeah, awd cars lose A LOT from being awd. my friends Subaru makes 230 to the crank, but they make like 165 to the wheels
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Old 10-13-2011, 10:36 AM
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Icon14 More ATTS win

ATTS uses radiator cooled, pressurized ATF fluid that greatly reduces its throughput losses when operating and promotes better operation and a expansion of its effective life span. LSD's have to slosh around in heavy, torque robbing,unpressurized, heavy gear oil .Also unlike the ATTS unit ,LSD's are always engaged even when going straight and generating non stop power losing drive train drag .
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Old 10-13-2011, 11:10 AM
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Re: More ATTS win

Quote:
Originally Posted by SHDRIVER View Post
ATTS uses radiator cooled, pressurized ATF fluid that greatly reduces its throughput losses when operating and promotes better operation and a expansion of its effective life span. LSD's have to slosh around in heavy, torque robbing,unpressurized, heavy gear oil .Also unlike the ATTS unit ,LSD's are always engaged even when going straight and generating non stop power losing drive train drag .
you do realize ATTS units rob far more hp and tq from your wheels than an LSD ever would. LSD sit inside the transmission, so yes, of course theyre going to be submersed in trans fluid. but you get all your power to both wheels all the time, instead of only with one like your beloved ATTS. power has to transfer through so many more things with an ATTS unit then an LSD. LSD can transfer more power safely, theyre a hell of a lot more dependable, and dont take nearly as much maintenance; making them far superior. so have fun with your extra 60~ lbs of weight
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:30 PM
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Re: atts limits?

sorry for this noob question but if i do get an LSD that means i would have to delete my atts unit right?
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Old 10-14-2011, 05:20 PM
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Re: atts limits?

That's a good question

But yeah.. You would have to remove the atts unit..

I really wouldn't worry about it until you are making enough hp to make the atts start acting up
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Old 10-14-2011, 05:42 PM
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Re: atts limits?

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sorry for this noob question but if i do get an LSD that means i would have to delete my atts unit right?

Yes : The lsd is a primitive and abrupt torque splitting device that is the finest in 1930es technology created in the 1935 by Mr Porsche. The ATTS unit is a advance torque splitting device that does a better job of precisely splitting torque between the wheels during cornering as conditions dictate using a Asimo so deleting it would not be advisable.




ATTS has sensors on its input that compute g forces and steering input for example to provide it the necessary data input and electronic hydraulic actuators on its output that engage the ATTS units mechanical torque splitting unit in a manner dictated by the driving conditions.They both accomplish the same basic task when cornering but in different ways so having both would serve no good purpose and not work correctly.

Last edited by SHDRIVER; 10-15-2011 at 12:03 AM.
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Old 10-14-2011, 05:55 PM
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Re: atts limits?

Most people putting gobs of horsepower to the wheels aren't using it to blast through the twisties.
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Old 10-14-2011, 10:44 PM
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Re: atts limits?

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Originally Posted by SHDRIVER View Post
Yes : The lsd is a primitive and abrupt torque splitting device created in the 1935 by Mr Porsche. The ATTS unit is a advance torque splitting device that does a better job of precisely splitting torque between the wheels during cornering as conditions dictate using a Asimo so deleting it would not be advisable.




ATTS has sensors on its input that compute g forces and steering input for example to provide it the necessary data input and electronic hydraulic actuators on its output that engage the ATTS units mechanical torque splitting unit in a manner dictated by the driving conditions.They both accomplish the same basic task when cornering but in different ways so having both would serve no good purpose and not work correctly.
Let's see that robot go 50 in a turn lol

SH- we get it. We know what atts is and what it does. It has it's limits though! And that's what this thread is about.

Are you a real person?
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Old 10-14-2011, 10:49 PM
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Re: atts limits?

SH = Asimo im pretty sure
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Old 10-14-2011, 10:51 PM
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Re: atts limits?

what the mother f*ck does a humanoid robot have to do with cornering/atts/preludes at all?!?! do you just camp at your computer and smoke crack or meth all day or something SH?

and no, they dont accomplish the same thing, considering the atts system shifts torque to the outside wheel when turning; where the lsd doesnt shift power at all, equal power to both wheels at all times.

and by the way, it was invented in '32, not '35
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Old 10-16-2011, 03:15 AM
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Re: atts limits?

The reason I ask this is because I have been saving up money for a while and close to 2 grand. Since my piston ring is broke and im still able to use the block I plan on getting the parts i want and putting it all together. My plan was to get type s pistons with skunk2 stage 1 cams and upgrade the valvetrain and as well as switch to carbon syncros and a lightweight flywheel with intake an header. I do know I will need way more money than I have but I do feel like I should do my research to carefully plan this out. I was wondering if anyone knows what my hp will be around?
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Old 10-16-2011, 10:21 AM
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Re: atts limits?

To the ground?

Like 200.

No... wait... That's AFTER getting it tuned.
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Old 10-17-2011, 09:06 AM
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Re: atts limits?

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Originally Posted by SHDRIVER View Post
Yes : The lsd is a primitive and abrupt torque splitting device that is the finest in 1930es technology created in the 1935 by Mr Porsche. The ATTS unit is a advance torque splitting device that does a better job of precisely splitting torque between the wheels during cornering as conditions dictate using a Asimo so deleting it would not be advisable.




ATTS has sensors on its input that compute g forces and steering input for example to provide it the necessary data input and electronic hydraulic actuators on its output that engage the ATTS units mechanical torque splitting unit in a manner dictated by the driving conditions.They both accomplish the same basic task when cornering but in different ways so having both would serve no good purpose and not work correctly.
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