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What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

 
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Old 09-11-2013, 05:44 PM
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What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

I have a 94 s auto f22a1 a.k.a. NyghtRyder.
I had just pulled into my destination and She shut off when I put her in park.
The D4 light went on as well as the CEL and no spark.
Got koeo codes will share later. (1, 2, 3, 8, 14)

Installed:
New Dizzy
ECU
Coil tested - ok
Main relay
1st shift solenoid -

Checked grounds - engine, tran, therm.

My mechanic is too busy and unwilling to charge me for the labor to search any further, so its up to me and my preludezone friends...
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Old 09-11-2013, 05:46 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

It stalled as you put it in park? Did it make any noises?
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Old 09-11-2013, 05:56 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

If the coil is confirmed good and you have no spark the problem has to be between there and the plug. Are you sure you installed the distributor right, not off by 180 degrees or something? Can you test for pulses at the plug ends of the wires?

I assume you already pulled the plugs and checked for old fashioned fouling?
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Old 09-11-2013, 06:29 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

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Originally Posted by Garurumon View Post
It stalled as you put it in park? Did it make any noises?
Nope, no noises at all. Her engine just shut off.
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Old 09-11-2013, 06:43 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGeorgeXIII View Post
If the coil is confirmed good and you have no spark the problem has to be between there and the plug. Are you sure you installed the distributor right, not off by 180 degrees or something? Can you test for pulses at the plug ends of the wires?

I assume you already pulled the plugs and checked for old fashioned fouling?
The Dizzy goes in one way + or - 10 degrees.
In my old dizzy I got a new ICM. (throwing parts at her)
No spark at the wire. (did bare metal test)
Pulled the plugs a week before doing emissions, ran fine, no fouling.
Used good gas 89octn.
New Dizzy complete with cap and rotor installed straight out the box.
Rotated the same angle as old one.

Cannot test for pulses at this time.
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Old 09-11-2013, 07:04 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Code 8 is for the Top Dead Center Sensor. If the ECU doesn't know where the crank is in relation to TDC, it may not be signaling the coil to produce a spark. Did you test the coil in the car?
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Old 09-11-2013, 07:43 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

I agree check the coil
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Old 09-11-2013, 08:19 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Does that motor have an ignitor?

Do you have/need a repair manual?
All Gen. Prelude Service Manuals
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Old 09-11-2013, 09:52 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGeorgeXIII View Post
Code 8 is for the Top Dead Center Sensor. If the ECU doesn't know where the crank is in relation to TDC, it may not be signaling the coil to produce a spark. Did you test the coil in the car?
I swapped my coil into an accord and the accord started right up.
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Old 09-11-2013, 09:56 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bykfixer View Post
Does that motor have an ignitor?

Do you have/need a repair manual?
All Gen. Prelude Service Manuals
Yes, t has an ICM. Its a 94 external coil.
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Old 09-11-2013, 10:11 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

You sure you didn't pop your timing belt?
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Old 09-11-2013, 10:34 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Sounds like a snapped timing belt or maybe it jumped too far... like Lindso said...

Take the valve cover off and check. Or check timing
You might of put it in park to fast.......
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:37 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyghtshayd View Post
I swapped my coil into an accord and the accord started right up.
That meshes with my theory pretty well. Here, pg 23-103 of the FSM:



The coil is driven by the igniter unit, which is driven by the ECU, which receives information about ignition timing from the TDC sensor. Replace that sensor and I bet it'll start right up.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:53 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

I believed there was something going on with the timing belt but I had my mechanic put an engine in with 77k on it with a new timing belt, water pump, dome seal, etc. I didn't believe there would be a problem after only 4 &1/2 yrs local driving.
I will check timing with TDC. I've never done this before (drat, its gonna be a tight squeeze with the engine in the car) but I have a youtube vid and a harder repair on my Mark VIII behind my belt. I will update you all.

Thank you.
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Old 09-12-2013, 02:03 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

well, are you nightshad i play coutnerstrike with? then i halp lmao
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Old 09-12-2013, 03:35 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by itsdatoneguy View Post
well, are you nightshad i play coutnerstrike with? then i halp lmao
No, I am the original Nyghtshayd from 1995.
My xbl GT is the same, pleased to meet you.
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Old 09-12-2013, 06:36 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

I vote to check your timing belt, pull your valve cover and check it out, if the cam isn't turning you aren't getting spark
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Old 09-14-2013, 12:50 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Update:
I knew the actual timing belt was ok because the rotor turns but projectprelude95 said that maybe the belt jumped... How da-heck can that happen??? the belt is on tight... as I rotated the main pulley I inspected the teeth and saw no sign of the belt jumping(broken or mis-shaped).

I also need to know how to stop the main pulley from turning when I try to remove the bolt.

(This does not look fun its close in there)
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Old 09-14-2013, 01:44 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

If you're talking about getting the crank bolt out, you'll need to get the crank pully removal tool <--(click that). To access it easier, you also need to loosen your drivers side motor mount and use a floor jack with a piece of wood to help control the height of the motor.
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Old 09-19-2013, 11:42 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Hey, what is the likelyhood there is a short somewhere?
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Old 09-23-2013, 11:41 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindso View Post
If you're talking about getting the crank bolt out, you'll need to get the crank pully removal tool <--(click that). To access it easier, you also need to loosen your drivers side motor mount and use a floor jack with a piece of wood to help control the height of the motor.
Apologies for the double post.
What are the odds that there is an electrical short somewhere?
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Old 11-08-2013, 04:45 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Ok, its been a while (lyfe etcetera) but here is my update:

No spark
D4 light flashing
CE light
code: 1, 2, 3, 8, 14

New dizzy
Coil check ok (swapped into accord it started)
Checked timing belt TDC. Also thru the access plug.

Any ideas on what else to check?
How would I know if it's the ECU?
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:17 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

i believe a bad ecu would report code 0. you said it is giving you a code? then it is probably fine.

check the fuses and wires. you said there was a d4 light, have you checked the code? there is a jumper (dont remember where in 4th gens) that should flash the engine code and transmission code
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Old 11-08-2013, 07:08 PM
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Icon14 Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Thanks for the reply!
The jumper is where I got the codes from and I know what the codes mean.
The real issue right now is the no spark and whether a transmission code could cause it in an automatic.
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Old 11-08-2013, 10:06 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Check your crankshaft position sensor, and your cam shaft sensor?
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Old 11-08-2013, 10:10 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

Lol just looked up your codes and code 4 is crank shaft sensor... check it out buddy...hopefully this solves your problem
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Old 11-09-2013, 12:26 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

You've got codes for so many sensors I wonder if you have a harness unplugged somewhere.

Anyway, was your new distributor intended for a 96+ car? The diagram I posted shows the cyl/crank/TDC sensor inside the distributor, but apparently the OBD II Preludes had the sensor moved to the oil pump... So if you installed the wrong type of distributor, you don't have that sensor anymore.
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Old 11-12-2013, 11:04 AM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

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Originally Posted by Project_Lude View Post
Lol just looked up your codes and code 4 is crank shaft sensor... check it out buddy...hopefully this solves your problem
I know what the codes are but thanks anyway.
I put a new dizzy in, that includes the igniter (ICM) that has the crank sensor.
Before that, I put a new ICM and still got ziltch.

I am wondering if the transmission code 2 on an automatic would cause the car not to spark.
Minding the fact that, after I came to a complete stop, the car shut itself off after I put it in park. (look, it rhymes!)
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Old 11-12-2013, 01:09 PM
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Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

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Originally Posted by Nyghtshayd View Post
I know what the codes are but thanks anyway.
I put a new dizzy in, that includes the igniter (ICM) that has the crank sensor.
Before that, I put a new ICM and still got ziltch.

I am wondering if the transmission code 2 on an automatic would cause the car not to spark.
Minding the fact that, after I came to a complete stop, the car shut itself off after I put it in park. (look, it rhymes!)
Ik u know what the codes are. So your telling me you replaced the crank sensor that goes to the crank? its not located in your dizzy...


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Old 11-12-2013, 01:27 PM
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Icon14 Re: What is the #@$%^&*! problem!

[QUOTE=Project_Lude;749746]Ik u know what the codes are. So your telling me you replaced the crank sensor that goes to the crank? its not located in your dizzy...


Oh, that thing! Let me go look at my engine and find the part somewhere.
Thanks!
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