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Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

 
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Old 10-19-2011, 09:30 PM
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Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Hi all,

I picked up a 94 VTEC last Thursday. She already has a name (Black) Beauty. Gonna do what it takes to get it stable. Guy said it passed smog and sure enough it did... back in July. It did not pass smog again. I had to re-smog it since he did not have the certificate and DMV would not transfer it. They really wanted the cert. Thinking it is no big deal, all my cars pass smog. I have regular upkeep and pet them and all that. Not the Beauty. It failed. I was already taking it into my favorite shop anyway for a once over to get a real handle on what is good and bad about her. Since the list was so long we agreed on having only the stuff to help pass smog done. New catalytic converter, new plugs (damn they are expensive platinum) and a oil change. They said the oil was gross. That is saying something right there. previous owner did not take care of her. $1100 later and I don't know if she will pass smog yet or not. Went there to get her re-tested and the doors were shut. SUCKS!!! k.. I will go on Saturday now.

Here is the Laundry List of stuff they found:
Replace: leaking distributor O-ring, V-tec o-ring, cam end plug and valve adjustment
Coolant leaks, overflow bottle was empty (they added some in) coolant cross over pipe o-ring is leaking and 2 coolant hoses next to oil filter are leaking. Upper radiator hose is showing wear
Valve cover breather tube
both outer CV b oots are split
Ignition wire cover missing bolt (no biggie but nice to have)
front endlink bushing are falling apart
front left turn signal housing is broken
front right finder liner is gone
oil leak under timing cover
Air box is missing all but one latch
hoot prop not attached to chassis
Emergency brake barely works
Front lower ball joints have a little play
Power steering rack is leaking on the drivers side plus pump is also seeping
break roaters are rust pitted and either replaced or tunred.

and the 150,000 mile maintenance needs to be done.

They previous owner loved to put the scented trees in her. My wife is allergic to those so the Beauty is getting an internal detail from an environmentally aware mobile detail guy. Will post info on how it goes. He is suppose to be here on Sunday.

I will get pictures this weekend. I know there are little dents here and there and some weird stuff on both back fenders that I am thinking might actually be some rust that has been painted / treated. The drivers seat has its side handles missing. the once that adjust the seat and set the memory. No Owners Manual so I get to play.. ooo what does this do... I plan to keep updating this thread as things go on.

Thanks in advance for all the help I will find and get here. Looking forward to diving in.
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Old 10-19-2011, 09:55 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

$1100 for a cat, new plugs, and an oil change? Only way I can justify this is if you live in cali, and you need to buy that special emission cat. That **** is expensive!
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Old 10-19-2011, 11:30 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

The cat was $631 and yes I am in Cali.

I am trying to figure out where to get some of these parts. There are these two hoses I find in the Shop Manual on pg 241 that I can't find at Majestic or HondaPartsCheeper.

They recommend that I get the coolant leaks fixed and those are part of the issue. it is the ones under the intake manifold.

Also thinking on getting the RED Silicon hoses. Want to do a Black with RED accents.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PRELUDE-92-9...ht_3220wt_1396

Last edited by makeitgo; 10-19-2011 at 11:33 PM.
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Old 10-20-2011, 12:38 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Im also in Cali. I paid 250. They welded it in and i passed smog. Marco Muffler. Just sayin.
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:19 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

That's sucks, I had no idea California was that anal lol I mean strict
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:33 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

250 is much cheeper. Oh well. I plan on doing what I can to get the rest of that list down myself. Stuff like the hoses and the CV boots, brakes and the like. not sure where the V-Tech o-ring is. and don't know how much I need to take apart to do the cam end plugs. The last time I did a valve adjustment was on a 1964 MGB. was not hard. I also had a mechanics switch to turn the engine to get the lifters in the right spot. I am fairly sure I can get the Transmission ground.

The Air box I might just replace with the cold air breather. (think that is what it is called)
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Old 10-20-2011, 10:11 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA




Beauty at home



Rear Quarter Panel. Is this rust?


interesting Dent in Hood. No idea what made it


Interior shot


Passenger Interior shot. it seems to be in good shape


Cup holder with the latch broken


Little chunk missing from same spot in both doors


Back seats. there is a tear in in the center column by one seam


Trunk Bay. previous owner liked the base. Of course he took it with him


Sunroof. Looks like this might also be rust.


the sunroof works!!


Engine bay.


Rocker Cover would like it to be nicer looking.


gonna need new peddles


here is my Tach issue. The car is not running and it registers 1K RPMs. It also bounces at times.



Blanks... what can I do with these.. mmm.... must plot and plan.

Last edited by makeitgo; 10-20-2011 at 10:27 PM.
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Old 10-20-2011, 11:51 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Wow that rust in cali... damn.
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Old 10-21-2011, 01:07 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Not really sure what to do with the possible rust spots. Any suggestions?
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Old 10-21-2011, 08:43 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

i have that issue with the tach too, I dont know how to fix it........... I think I will have to buy another EL Gauges :/
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Old 10-24-2011, 12:51 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

She did not pass smog again. EGR stuff this time.

I did get her interior detailed. Seats are a lighter color after the steam water vacuum cleaning. Guy came to my house and did a decent job.
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Old 10-24-2011, 06:19 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Are those blank spots right near the center compartment?
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:37 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Yes they are. Those blanks are just under the arm rest.
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Old 10-28-2011, 10:58 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

nice car.i cant wait to get my hands on one.
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Old 10-29-2011, 12:16 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Wow dude this lude has soo much potential
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Old 10-29-2011, 10:55 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

I am about to pick her up from shop 1 and take her to smog test and repair place. Her valves were way over tight. Also found out that the clutch MC is leaking.

So on my DIY list I have
brake rotors and pads
Clutch master and slave
All radiator hoses.

I am hoping the emissions will pass with out much more $$

Previous owner did not take care of her at all.

Thanks for all the replies and wealth of info in here. I hope I can add to it.
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Old 11-02-2011, 05:19 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

She has been at the Test and Repair smog place since Saturday and the last I have heard they found an issue with the O2 Sensor giving out bad Voltage and they think that is what is causing the issue to the EGR system not going into a closed loop. Last I talked to them they were stumped and where trying to figure out what to do next. If any of y'all have any ideas of what to check please shot them my way. I have posted the question in this other post HELP O2 Sensor with Bad Voltage as well. no responses. I am kinda stuck here.

Thanks
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Old 11-02-2011, 06:22 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

The EGR system is working 100% as it is supposed to manually. The shop is going to hunt for ECU to replace mine with and hopefully that will fix the voltage issue.

When I look at the history of this car via the smog site it shows FAIL FAIL FAIL PASS FAIL FAIL FAIL PASS. so it has a history of failing. I just don't know why
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Old 11-08-2011, 12:34 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

So I have her back from the Test and Repair guys. They had her for a week checking this and that and rechecking. The only thing they can think it is at this point is the ECU. I have been hunting for one for a few days now and no luck. I am going to have to pull hers out and ship it off to be rebuilt. Luckily I am not using her as a daily commuter. I will get some pics of the ECU before and after.

I also picked up a new break kit for front and rear. I also plan to do Clutch Master and Slave. Soo looking forward to that cotter pin and hidden nuts. And then there are the coolant leaks. So much fun.
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Old 11-08-2011, 05:45 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Man good luck. My Lude failed smog (4 times) and I had no money to make repairs. Quit my job because I was moving sold my integra and a Mac book pro to buy the lude. But luckly I have a master mechanic for a dad and a uncle that owns a smog shop. I have oil leaks on both sides of my motor And I believe my break master cylinder is going bad and I have a nasty hole in my flex pipe. I'm on pretty much the same boat because I think my car has the same issues as yours does.
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Old 11-08-2011, 11:22 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Thanks HueyTat! Where you at in Cali? I hope getting the ECU repaired will take care of the issues. While hunting for the ECU I was told that the VTEC is the one that fails the most and people buy them up as soon as they hit the market for rebuilds and such.
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Old 11-14-2011, 04:02 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Adventures this weekend included replacing the Clutch Master cylinder and Slave. I found some great tips here to help with that process. I will highlight them here and hunt down the links so others can get the full benefit.

Great write up No more CLUTCH PROBLEM threads!!!

and this one How To Clutch Master Cylinder

Remove the passenger side fan from the radiator: you need to remove the top hose. I needed to replace my hoses so I just drained my radiator and removed the upper hose. I also removed the brackets for the hoses and the left hand bracket for the radiator. there are four bolts securing the fan. The two top ones need to come fully out. the bottom ones only need to be loosened and the fan will slip off of them. very helpful. Disconnect the electrical connection when you are down under the car. it is toward the passenger wheel well.

Set the slave up for bleeding: get a cup / jar that you can put a bleeder hose into and attach it to the nipple. open the nipple. open the clutch reservoir and press the clutch in to start the process of removing the fluid. This should start to get all the fluid in the lines out of the reservoir and allow the clutch to go all the way to the floor and stay there.

Remove the reservoir and the hard line into the master cylinder.

Take the drivers seat out. The amount of time you spend taking out the seat will greatly improve your mood and ability to get in under the dash. 14mm in front and 12mm in back. there was one electrical connection that was easy to remove. 29ftpds torch to re-install

I used a head light to help me see up under the dash. (one less thing to hold onto.)

The cotter pin: mine was wrapped around both sides of the pin. I used some bent needle nose pliers to get it started. I ended up using my fingers to get the tails pretty straight. I then grabbed the head and pulled. took a little bit but it came out.

The nuts for the Master cylinder: The upper bolt seemed impossible to get to. What I did is have a long socket and a long extension. I was able to thread this in pretty easily and had wiggled my fingers up to the upper nut to guide it onto the bolt. Once I had the nut loose I could do the rest with fingers.

Remove the master cylinder from the firewall and clean up the spilled fluid.

Insert new master cylinder into the firewall and make sure the hard line is seated into the master cylinder.

Go back under the dash and align the rod of the master to the clutch peddle. Screw in the nuts and then insert shaft and new cotter pin. This can be replaced with a Hitch Pin described in this post How To Clutch Master Cylinder. Much easier to put in and take out next time. Back in the engine bay, tighten the hard line onto the master cylinder, connect the reservoir to the master, and re-attach the reservoir.

disconnect the slave cylinder. Unscrew the hard line then the two bolts under the slave holding it onto the engine. Unhook the bleed line making sure to not spill if you can. Grease the head of the new slave and the clutch arm it sets into with high temp grease. Seat the hard line into the slave, put the head into the arm and insert bolts. Tighten the hard line into the slave.

Bleeding the system: Add bleeder hose onto the slave and put one end into a container like before. Fill the reservoir with Dot3/4 and pump the clutch in and out by hand. Keep an eye out on the reservoir and make sure it does not run out of fluid. When you see fluid in the bleeder hose, tighten the nipple. the clutch should now spring back like normal. Continue to pump to build up some pressure and then gently open the bleeding nipple on the slave a little to let any bubbles come out. If you open it too much the peddle will drop to the floor again. When no more bubbles come out you are done. Clean up and reassemble.
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Old 11-14-2011, 06:56 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

Also last weekend I took my ECU out and mailed it to Texas to get it rebuilt. So while it is no working I am doing so needed repairs.....

My next trick is to figure out how to remove the intake manifold so I can get to a couple of the hoses underneath it. When doing the clutch work I looked at the task ahead and am a little daunted. I need to figure out how I am going to even find the manifold bolts. One suggestion I have gotten was to label everything so I can put it all back together. it is still daunting.

Any help / suggestions would be greatly welcome.

A simpler task, also on the list, will be to replace all the disk brakes and pads. Parts on on order and will be here today or tomorrow... I hope..
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Old 11-19-2011, 08:12 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

This morning I was all excited to put on my new breaks. spent 2 hours trying to get the front rotor off. I bought the impact driver and was finally able to get the screws off and then could not get the rotor off. Gave in and called my bro who has has been doing the mechanic thing for almost 40 years. Told me there are these two threaded holds on the rotor that you put bolts into and it will push it away and you crank on the bolt. The manual said the basically the same thing except that I did not see it that way. They are 8mm 1.25 bolts and I go the 40 mm length. Really only need about 25 -30 length. They worked great. 1/4 turn each back and forth and there off.

Got the fronts done. Then moved onto the backs... I ran into two issues. 1) could not get the screws off the back rotors. My bro said to just keep at it. 2) the caliper would not depress. will most likely need to open the nipple and bleed the break a little to get it to sink back for the new pads. Any suggestions?? will also hunt in the manuals I have to see what they say about the back breaks.

ECU is still in Texas. I hope to get it back before Thanksgiving weekend to actually be able to drive it again.
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Old 12-10-2011, 03:00 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

So the latest...

I got the ECU back from GoECM in TX and they took their time... they had it for two plus weeks. They found bad capacitors and fixed them. So now I have a working ECU. It has some improvement on the NOx levels but not enough. There is something else wrong. no idea what.

While waiting I got drilled and slotted rotors and ceramic breaks on as well as the master and slave clutch installed.

I am at a lot as to what to do next.
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Old 12-10-2011, 07:09 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

This might help with some stuff you listed.

EGR cleaning.
ENG: Cleaning EGR Valve/Ports video

Cam plug
ENG: 5th gen - change cam seal

Removal of IM. DIY installs a Euro R IM for better performance but I'm sure you can figure it out.
ENG: H22 Euro R IM
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Old 12-11-2011, 06:10 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

frankyjmr. Thanks for the links. the last one was really good on the IM. thanks. May need to try some of that EGR cleaning thing. kinda nervous taking a drill to stuff though.

The Cam seals were changed and the VTEC oring have also been done. I let the shop do that part.
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Old 12-14-2011, 07:33 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

brother, i had the exact same problem with my 4th gen a while back... it ended up being the throttle body... it has a sensor in it, that if broken causes idling issues which can mean failing an emissions test easy. replace your TB and see if that makes a difference.
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Old 01-14-2012, 02:00 AM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

So.. I just got word from the shop she finally passed smog. They had to fix all the water leaks under the intake manifold and while doing that they cleaned out all the jets and intake manifold. I put in about $3K to get her to pass smog. Glad I love the car. There is still more stuff to fix but at least I can finish the transfer process started in October. Thanks for all your suggestions.

I have the CV Boots and a drive train that is a little loose (so they tell me), grounding wires that should be replaced, oil pan gasket, climate control issues, and other stuff.
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Old 01-14-2012, 06:09 PM
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Re: Beauty - 94 VTEC SAGA

3k you could have gotten a fresh motor of your choice that would more than likely pass smog with a nice tune up. Just sayinng. But glad you got it all worked out :)
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